That was good. Being a "Bush-ite," as some say, I obviously feel that the war in Iraq was justified and needed. But I think you handled the subject well.

Phoenix:
I have not seen F911 but I have heard enough about the movie and listened to enough Anti-Bush people to form my own opinion. I do not believe that Bush was wrong to send us to war or to stay in Iraq to fix the govnt afterward. I DO have a problem with the fact that we have yet to find, let alone capture, Osama Bin Laden, as he was our original target. If Bush is at fault for anything, it is for getting side-tracked with Saddam instead of going for Bin Laden. I understand that Saddam has been a threat in the past but that is no basis for going after him and making up a story about secret "weapons of Mass Destruction".
One must always remember that, when dealing with politicians or with those who strongly oppose/support them, propaganda is always an issue. No politician is not biased. No person with a very strong opinion is not biased (ahem, Moore). I do not believe (as some people might) that Bush is the Anti-Christ or the devil or whatever else they're calling him these days. People blame him for America's economic problems. I belive he was in the wrong place at the wrong time (like Herbert Hoover, who was blamed for the Great Depression even though he only inherited a crap economy. Bush had the bad luck to inherit a failing economy from Clinton. Clinton is only remembered as a 'good' president because he inherited a well-off economy.). One man cannot bring down an entire economy, and if people disagree with that, then they have no faith in America. People also blame Bush for the war in Iraq...well, I have one thing to say to that, almost 100% of the nation was saying "Gung-ho!" for war after September 11. People asked for war and they got it--agreeing with popular opinion should not put Bush on the "Bad List" of presidents.
Well, this is starting to turn into a rant...or an essay itself, so I'll stop. I think you get my point. All in all, your essay was good, I just think you should maybe do a bit more research before condemning Bush.
-Aillil

You need not worry about the bias of Kopel. He, at least, has had the decency to amend his story when something in it is found that isn’t true, and even properly labels something as a “deceit” or a “cheap shot.” He now has links to Moore’s web-site next to his arguments where Moore has attempted to defend his film. Comparing the two, I think you will find that Moore’s silence on his distortions speaks volumes. His method is a curious mix of proving that which was never in dispute and passing off his critics as right-wing “wacko-attackos.”

I have based my opinion of Moore on far more than just F-9/11. He has had quite a lot to say that never gets generally reported. Seems he is a bit more vocal when not in front of an American audience and has views which conflict with the personality he presents to us back at home or the public at large. The following quotes are a few tidbits from him, and whatever emphasis you see are his and not mine (he’s rather fond of the [Caps Lock]).

“Of course many Israeli children had died too, at the hands of the Palestinians. You would think that would make every Israeli want to wipe out the Arab world, but the average Israeli does not have that response. Why? Because IN THEIR HEARTS, THEY KNOW THEY ARE WRONG, AND THEY KNOW THEY WOULD BE DOING JUST WHAT THE PALESTINIANS ARE DOING IF THE SANDAL WERE ON THE OTHER FOOT.”

While promoting his book, “Dude Where’s My Country,” in Germany, Moore gave a speech in which he asserted that, “Americans are possibly the dumbest people on the planet….in thrall to conniving, thieving, smug pricks. We Americans suffer from an enforced ignorance. We don’t know about anything that’s happening outside our country. Our stupidity is embarrassing.” (The Washington Dispatch, June 26, 2004)

“The Iraqis who have risen up against the occupation are not "insurgents" or "terrorists" or "The Enemy." They are the REVOLUTION, the Minutemen, and their numbers will grow -- and they will win.”

These are words that he has either spoken or displayed on his website, and his activities go far beyond what little bit I’ve shown you here. Putting it bluntly: He is perhaps the Jane Fonda of my generation, giving little in the way of material support to our enemies, but free propaganda that is every bit as dangerous as bullets.

If he does not know the ends to which his distortions are being used, he is a fool. If he does, then he is a treasonous fool.

As for Bush being on par with Mike, I must disagree. The Senate Intelligence Committee (anything but a right-wing stooge) has cleared the White House on “manipulating” intelligence on Iraq. Further, the only exposed administration “lie”—the yellowcake uranium from Africa Bush mentioned in his state of the Union address—turns out to have been truthful; it was the ambassador who’d done the lying. Meanwhile, Moore has been purposely deceitful more times in F-9/11 than Bush has in his entire four years in office and gets lauded for “brilliance.”

Fahrenheit 9-11 is what Moore has made it: expensive propaganda. Its central arguments dissolve even under the lightest scrutiny, it brings nothing new or interesting to the debate, and as a work of fiction it has a weaker premise than Planet of the Apes. I didn’t even pay money to see it, and I still felt robbed at the end.

You asked for my insight, and you got it. ;)

I read that you said that the second half was manipulative in the way that it showed the soldier's mother reading the last letter and crying. I saw that woman on MSNBC and she said that Michael Moore gave her full editing rights over what parts of her story were shown in the movie. He did not decide what went in there for her part. That's all I wanted to say.
-Fahrenheit 9/11..Michael Moore fan in Ohio
-peace-

Well, I have not seen the movie, but I must say, this is a wonderful piece of work. You bring up both the pros and cons of his movie, and you write it in an understandable, objective way. (Maybe a little leaning towards being against the way he did his film.) Nicely done.

Politicians will screw you, there is a simple remedy to it.. by not voting.

However, Moore is Satan. I recommend the upcoming documentry 'Micheal Moore Hates America'- which shows Moore's brilliant... even genius, filming strategy.

But until then, Government is gonna ** you.

-Curtis

I think that even if you don't like Micheal Moore you should go see the movie, unless you want to block out anything that goes agianst your opinion (which I have seen a lot of people do).

well... the best part about "fahrenheit 9/11" is that it at least encourages people to talk about the issues he brings up, whether he lies or tells the truth. i know that at my own home there have been heated debates over the legitimacy and truth in moore's film. it is good to discuss such things.
however, the more i think about "fahrenheit" the less i like it. the worst manipulation moore uses are his images of happy iraqis before the u.s. entered, painting pre-war iraq as some sort of happy, thriving wonderland, which it wasn't, for the most part.
your essay was well written, especially if it was written off of a "gut" reaction, like you stated in the beginning. i suggest you research the film on your own before believing everything, but then, i would suggest that about anything someone else tells you. remember the quote from that man from flint? it went something like, "you can't trust nobody you don't know, and even if you do know them, you still can't trust 'em."

I think that you have been duped. Regardless of his politics, Moore is a guy to be loathed for his blatant propaganda and his collusion with those who would see America burn.

Understand that this is not a knee-jerk reaction. I actually did quite a bit of research before seeing Moore for what he really is. That you are calling either F-9/11 or Bowling "logical" or “factual” shows that you’ve fallen for his act hook line and sinker. I refer you to these two sites, each of which deal with the liberties Moore takes with the truth:

http://w w w.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htm

http://w w w.hardylaw.net/Truth_About_Bowling.html

I also encourage you to read “Michael Moore Is a Big Fat Stupid White Man” (The title was selected for parody of both Moore and Franken; not malice) by David Hardy and Jason Clarke for further information about his career and his books. You will notice a distinct conservative tint, but you will also notice that what they cite cannot be disputed. E-mail me if you want more links to explore.

*The "w's" for the links have been spaced out since FP likes to delete what it considers "extras."

I saw it, and it didn't convince me of anything. I went into that movie theater certain I will not be voting for Bush come November (don't celebrate, all youse lefties, you haven't turned Mbwun; I'm not voting for Kerry, either). By showing only one side of the issue, Moore only reinforced the views people already have--folks who love him continue to love him; folks who hate him continue to hate him; folks on the fence get angry at the dumbshites who feel compelled to cheer at every one of Moore's points (this is me, btw). By not exploring the opposite side of the issue, Moore really can't prove that his argument is better than the other guy's.

Also, Moore didn't always seem to know what his argument was. Either the US isn't doing enough to combat terrorism, or it's doing too much (his diatribe on the PATRIOT Act). Either US servicemen in Iraq are innocent victims of a corrupt regime, or they're sick bastards (good ol' "Burn-**-burn" tank driver dude). He contradicts himself more than he does Bush!

Btw, the first half was just as manipulative as the second. Moore was just more subtle about it. Remember how sinister he made the simple act (that every politician, Republican, Democract, Michael Moore, does) of preparing for a TV broadcast?

~He Who Walks On All Fours

I watched Farneheit, and I must say that I throughly enjoyed it; esspecially the part with the Iraqi grandmother cursing the US...I found it powerful. I am a huge fan of Michael Moore, and I think that if you liked that film you should read his book 'Dude, Where is my country'
DarkSorceress