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Fractured Illusion

And this should be also for Easy Fix Multi?

Lefty! What is your opinion?

4/28/2008 #991
Kyllorac

I don't think Easy Fix Multi needs it. The review requirements are not as demanding as in Multi.

4/28/2008 #992
Imalefty

i think that perhaps the amount of words you review should be about the same number of words you request (you could request less, though) i guess this would require counting words (or just averaging the word count could be fine, i guess)

but uh... let's take an example. (hypothetical, of course)

Person A: Please review two chapters of "This." (considering that this is how it would start... since we've already had multi chap up for some time)

Person B: I reviewed two chapters of this, which were about ~1000 words each (2000 words total). Please review two chapters of "That" - they're only ~1000 words each.

Person C: I reviewed three chapters of "That," which is about 3000 words. Please review two chapters of "My Story," since each chapter is ~1500 words.

or something... actually that's rather complicated. never mind. XD

otherwise, i think kylie's suggestion is good... the problem would be that the people would have to read the rules... and uh... be honest. XD

also, what happens if people write different chapter lengths? so one might be 3000 words and the next if 4000 words...? how do we solve that? aaaagh!

hmmm... we could do it on average length of chapter (ie... # of words / # of chapters) and then they could only request in their chapter range... like...

Person A: Please review two chapters of "This," average 3000 words.

or something? aaagh, this is so complex.

i uh... i actually think this should be imposed on both easy fix and depth, since... if you're going to only be giving (and getting) and easy fix review, it shouldn't be too labor intensive... XD

i don't know. T_T

-Lefty

4/28/2008 #993
B. J. Winters

Actually Lefty might be on to something. We are looking for fairness. While one chapter/one chapter is typically fair, it's not always the case once you start doing multiples.

So, recasting the post as:

I read 2 chapters of X (5000 words)

Please read 3 chapters of Y (4500 words).

Might allow people to understand more about what they can expect in return. Right now you have a rule that you can't request more chapters than you read - but if what I read is 3 times as long as what I request, I'm reluctant to take the plunge. I'd leave the cap at 5 chapters though or this could get out of control fast.

The other thing you might do is lower the cap to three chapters and/or put a cap on the number of words requested (no more than 15000)

4/28/2008 . Edited 4/28/2008 #994
Fractured Illusion

Okay. The major weakness about these count-the-words type of deals that have been presented in the last two posts is that they are NOT simple.

True fairness can never exist. We should aim for simplicity rather than the truest form of justice.

A rule need to be simple. Currently you can request a maximum of 6 chapters, but this rarely happens.

I suggest:

If you have one chapter above 4000 words, you can only request 4 chapters. If you have more than one chapter with +4000 words, you can only request 3 chapters. This is not as punishment for those with length, but it is so the game will not be hindered. Also, i think people need to realize we are dealing with a computer screen, and massive chapters are never kind to anyone.

Why 3? 2 may be a bit too harsh in my view, as it is the barest minimum. Also, it is at 4 we are getting the real problems with people having to read it. 3 is a nice middle ground.

1 chapter with 4000 words or more: Max request - 4 chapters

More than 1 chapter with 4000 words or more: Max request - 3 chapters

How about it?

Although your ideas, Lefty and B.J, were well thought out, I think it will too complicated and not easy to adjust to.

4/29/2008 #995
Otseis Ragnarok

How about the chap cap is based on word count?

If two chapters take up 5000+ words, then you really shouldn't request more than that.

I'd say make it a suggestion, not a rule. More out of courtesy than anything else.

4/29/2008 #996
B. J. Winters

If we're going for simplicity then I'd go with totals. Rather than a per chapter limit - but a max word (total) limit -- and then a chapter guideline.

So the rule reads:

You may request between 2 and 5 chapters based on the number of chapters that you read. To keep the game moving, please try to limit your request to 20,000 words or less at a maximum. You can always request again later for additional chapters on the same story.

4/29/2008 #997
Kyllorac

You may request between 2 and 5 chapters based on the number of chapters that you read. To keep the game moving, please try to limit your request to 20,000 total words or less at a maximum. You can always request again later for additional chapters on the same story.

I think this is very simple and straightforward. Rather than a chapter-by-chapter wordcount, it's just overall wordcount of the chapters you're requesting which simplifies matters quite a bit. And the rule where you can't request more chapters than you've reviewed still applies. The total I added in would need to be there else we might be seeing 20,000 word long chapters, though.

4/29/2008 #998
Otseis Ragnarok

You may request between 2 and 5 chapters based on the number of chapters that you read. To keep the game moving, please try to limit your request to 20,000 total words or less at a maximum. You can always request again later for additional chapters on the same story.

Why not do that for the regular Review Game, too?

[I always thought that should've been the easy-fix requirements...]

4/29/2008 . Edited 4/29/2008 #999
Imalefty

what happens if we get two chapters that are 20,000 words total? O_O that would be a nightmare. (unlikely, but it could still happen.) or, perhaps more realistically, two chapters that are... 18,000 words total? i would definitely not read that in return for two reviews on my measly 2,000 word per chapter story... T_T

i think frac's idea is best right now (plust the 20,000 as a courtesy side note) since it's the simplest. might not be the fairest, but definitely the simplest.

-Lefty

4/29/2008 #1,000
Imalefty

new page! :D

-Lefty

4/29/2008 #1,001
Fractured Illusion

Okay, so we will incorporate this idea for both Multi Depth and EF right? Just want to make things clear before I go changing things.

4/30/2008 #1,002
Otseis Ragnarok

Okay, so we will incorporate this idea for both Multi Depth and EF right? Just want to make things clear before I go changing things.

Could you clarify which ideas these are?

4/30/2008 #1,003
rassoodock

i suggest threads dedicated to music and politics.

5/1/2008 #1,004
Fractured Illusion

@Lefty

I still want my question answered in second post on this page

@Rassy

What does this have to do with reviews? O.o

5/1/2008 . Edited 5/1/2008 #1,005
rassoodock

nothing, but you told me to bring my suggestions here.

5/1/2008 #1,006
Fractured Illusion

Indeed I did.

But we add suggested topics only if they are relevant to our "area" somehow (or if you can talk us into it any other way?). And music and politics doesn't really have to do with the things RG is about.

I do recommend the other top forums of General. I think they have these kind of threads.

5/1/2008 #1,007
Imalefty

Okay, so we will incorporate this idea for both Multi Depth and EF right? Just want to make things clear before I go changing things.

yes! i think... well, it would make sense, since i think that this kind of thing can happen on EF, too... it just hasn't yet. :) better be safe than sorry.

-Lefty

5/1/2008 #1,008
Imalefty

oh, and the suggestion is:

1 chapter with 4000 words or more: Max request - 4 chapters

More than 1 chapter with 4000 words or more: Max request - 3 chapters

-Lefty

5/1/2008 #1,009
Otseis Ragnarok

If y'all think it wil help flow, then I'm all for it.

5/3/2008 #1,010
Fractured Illusion

Rule of max 4,000 words per chapter has been enforced as Rule 17.

It has been added to the first post in both Multi, as well as a special notice post at the end of both topics.

@Lefty - alert me if you think there should be any changes in the rule/posts (even if only that there is a spelling mistake or something) :P

@Onar - stop spamming! It has already been decided. If you are pro or again doesn't matter now. I don't care how much you want your name on every last post, this is getting annoying -.-''

5/3/2008 #1,011
Fractured Illusion

@RM Sug

Should I prolong the review-the-winners deadline or something? I'm a bit alarmed at how unresponsive people have been for this round

5/4/2008 #1,012
Imalefty

instead of prolonging it, add something in the rules that says you can REQUEST for an extension... (if life is being difficult or something and you don't have enough time.) if you give them more time to review, it'll just encourage procrastination, and those people who don't intend to review won't do it anyway. (gee, this is so pessimistic sounding... ^_^;;)

and i think that after one PM from each of us, we shouldn't remind them anymore. i mean... after two reminders, if they're not going to do it, they're just not going to do it.

maybe we should figure out WHY people don't want to give out prize reviews? because it's not like they FORGET... (we remind them enough...)

oh, also, are we going to make it so that people can't register until the week of the RM, or something like that? so that people don't forget that it's happening? O.o?

-Lefty

5/4/2008 #1,013
Fractured Illusion

oh, also, are we going to make it so that people can't register until the week of the RM, or something like that? so that people don't forget that it's happening? O.o?

Yeah, I think I will do something like that. This RM was disastrous. It's better with a few motivated people than a bunch of non-committed people.

People can already request for extension though...but its not a rule. I guess I can make it a rule, since I allow it either way.

I too want to know why people don't want to review. It's not THAT hard or time consuming :/ And if RL is too much they can just PM and say they want more time. I'd ask them all meself but no one is responding haha.

Edit: Rule has been added. Its the newest one

5/4/2008 . Edited 5/4/2008 #1,014
Otseis Ragnarok

@Multi Idea: I think that word count should directly influence the number of chaps you request. If you have 5 chaps at under 4000 words total, you should be able to request all 5 chaps... (Or something like that....)

5/6/2008 #1,015
KnittingKneedle

That doesn't seem fair...because we're rewarding shorter chapters, I think the idea as it stands is practical for upping the activity...

5/6/2008 #1,016
Otseis Ragnarok

It's actually quite fair. Think about it. If someone writes something that short, why wouldn't you read/review it all? And if they already gave a review for something longer, why shouldn't they be entitled to a review for their works?

5/6/2008 #1,017
Jesse the Storyteller

The discussion of all the word counts for chapters is kind of pointless to me, because... if I request that you read something ridiculously huge, and you look at it and see that it is ridiculously huge, then... don't do it. o.O If you're thinking "I don't want to read your 20,000 word story just to get a review for my measely 2,000 word story" then... don't. Wait for someone else to do it and then review theirs. Nobody says you HAVE TO. It's completely fair because you don't have to do it if you don't want to, haha.

-Jesse

5/6/2008 #1,018
Harmonic Discord

Re: I too want to know why people don't want to review.

Everyone's ridiculously busy at this time of year. Finals and all that. So it may just be that they don't have time...

5/6/2008 #1,019
Fractured Illusion

@Onar's sug

No, Onar. The whole issue of word count isn't a thing to be on focus in the RGs. Only reason we implemented the 4000 wordcount is because few are willing to do 4 or more chapters of that. In normal RGs we dont focus on word count at all. In Multi we do only because of circumstances. Your idea has nothing to do with circumstances. And like TT said, it'd be rewarding for short chapters, which we don't want to do. Also, giving two reviews to get 5? No I dont think so. It is as it was before: You can NEVER request more reviews than you gave. If you reviewed 5 chapters? Okay fine, request 5 chapters. But dont go thinking you should be entitled to request for more than you give :/

RGs main focus is the reviews, not the wordcount.

I reject.

5/7/2008 #1,020
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