The Second Gathering Of The Light
Convert and be saved. Here you can discuss the book of the light. Light Bless.
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Kaleb-of-Sand
Post here a verse from the book of light and i will bless you with the light. Light Bless.
11/21/2007 #1
C-Mack15
So um...just curious but are you making a new religion or something?
11/28/2007 #2
Kaleb-of-Sand
No, this religion has been here for a while. It is only now that we have came to raise and show people of the light.
12/7/2007 #3
Kaleb-of-Sand
Here is The Book Of Seamus for you to under stand:

Seamus 1

1.On the thirteen day of the six month for the twentieth century of the seventh decade of the fifth year,

2.Born in New York, Seamus was.

3.On the fifth year of his life, his parents died and he had to defend for himself.

4.For ten years, he battled it out on the street.

5.He got the point that he wanted to die,

6.But the light appeared.

7.It said, “Don’t give up Seamus for that I have chosen you to be the great prophet to teach the world the truth.

8.“I will give you powers over earth, for that you are a friend of the grass and the living.

9.“Convert those who are slaves of false god,

10.“But show them that they can be their own, gods within my rules.

11.“Now go, Seamus the Wise”.

12.Behold on the street was an old man dying.

13.Seamus touched him and from that hour he was living,

14.He walked the earth telling people of Seamus.

15.Behold there was a man named Gareth Vandersleld who lived in the darkness.

16.He took strange drinks that turned him into darkness.

17.Seamus walked up to him and said,

18.“Rise, for the light needs you,

19.“Behold our new prophet, Gareth the Fire Master”.

20.Therefore, Gareth went off converting people to the light.

21.Seamus went into the main square and spoke to the people with,

22.“Your light blinds you but mine doesn’t.

23.“You god has lied to you and only wants your money,

24.“For I can make things better.

25.“Believe in the light and I will make prophets out of all of you”.

26.After he spoke those words, many people converted, gaining the power of earth.

Seamus 2

1.Behold there was a tree that was dying,

2.Its leafs where scattered across the ground.

3.Seamus used his power of earth to heal the tree.

4.From that hour it had became bright as green.

5.There was a group of men who wanted the tree down, for they want its land for building.

6.They got together to discus the problem with Seamus.

7.They decided to kill Seamus.

8.When Seamus heard of this he lefted.

9.Behold on the street was a bunch of people listening to a false prophet,

10.Who was teaching things of false gods,

11.Converting people into slavery.

12.So Seamus stepped up saying,

13.“why do you convert people to a lie, oh wicked one.

14.“Why give up your life to a lie.

15.“Believe in the light and no lies will be told.

16.“For there was once a man who wanted to now who his father was,

17.“And there was a man wanted his money for the other man was dying,

18.“For his last wish was to give his money to his father,

19.“For his father gave him birth.

20.“So the man lied to the sick saying, ‘I am the one who gave birth to you’.

21.“So the sick gave the man all his money.

22.“Behold this is what happened to all of you,

23.“Giving your life to lie, don’t do.

24.“For the light has given us the power to control our own life”.

25.After what he spoke, they all believed.

26.Once converted, he gave all different powers.

27.He choose seven of those who listen to help him out.

28.There names were: Max of water, Sally of Earth, Zeke of Earth, Samson of Fire,

29.Harold of Air, Rebecca of water and Luke of Fire.

Seamus 3

1.Once he had chosen them, he took them a side saying,

2.“I will teach you the way of the light, Isurak.

3.“to master Earth you must become one with nature,

4.“Let the trees be your guide.

5.“Treat all life as if yourself.

6.“For there once was a man who treat the trees with out value.

7.“He cut them down with will.

8.“Another man treated the trees like his friend.

9.“When the man who didn’t valued the trees died,

10.“His life was no more.

11.“When the man who valued the trees died,

12.“His life began again.

13.“For the light does not allow those who don’t value others to live,

14.“For they would kill others.

15.“Those who treat others the way they want themselves will gain the highest reward,

16.“Life will go on and on, forever and ever, with in light’s comfort.

17.“For those who have the power of fire,

18.“They must use there power only rarely,

19.“For when their friends are in danger,

20.“But not to kill, no, not ever.

21.“For killing is steeling someone else right to live.

22.“They then are controlling other people’s fate.

23.“To those who are of air,

24.“You can travel with ease,

25.“Use it to help others.

26.“With this power, you can create storms or stop them.

27.“It is powerful, and must not be used for evil.

28.“For the ones who control powers of water,

29.“You are friends of the sea,

30.“With your powers, you can give life to those where life it self can go normally.

31.“Don’t use it for evil for this power will kill with ease,

32.“Create waves to destroy all in its way.

33.“But don’t, for it is taking away life.

34.“I warn you all of dark ones,

35.“They control powers of darkness.

36.“For the fate of this world is at hand.

37.“There are dark spirits, giving many people dark powers.

38.“Curse them for they will hunt us down, right to the end of the world.

39.“They want our world to end, so the light came to save us in teaching me all the things the world once knew but forgot.

40.“For I will teach people of the light.

41.“Others will do the same,

42.“But I am the first to do so,

43.“Some will come with new powers and others with mine.

44.“One day you will all be teachers like me”.

45.From then on, they all began to practice the powers,

46.While following Seamus.

Seamus 4

1.Behold there was a man of dark powers,

2.When Seamus came, it began to scream, crying, “Seamus, have mercy on me”.

3.Seamus used his powers to take away the dark powers of the man.

4.Seamus then came to the city of Hartford.

5.He began to teach them saying, “I am of the light, which shows the way.

6.“For the light show the way clearly”

7.They were all amazed and converted.

8.Behold there was some evil men who hated Seamus,

9.Therefore, they plotted to kill him, while on the streets of Hartford.

10.Harold of air, hearing this, warned Seamus to leave.

11.So Seamus lefted, and began to go to Albany.

12.While traveling there he saw a man that was blind all his life.

13.Therefore, Seamus cured him so he could see.

14.His name was Dames, which then gain the powers of air.

15.Behold there was a man who was dying,

16.Seamus put his hand on him and he was cured.

17.So he came to Albany, and many people came, welcoming him.

18.He then began to teach them saying,

19.“Don’t be afraid of the light, for it wants you to be friends with it.

20.“For I, like many, are witnesses of what the light can do.

21.“So I ask you now, follow the light to be saved”.

22.A few believed and followed him but many of them kicked him out of the city for speaking lies.

23.Therefore, he went to Boston, to teach all that come.

24.Once he came, he opened his mouth and said, “I do not come to hurt you but to free from slavery,

25.“Behold I will heal right now”

26.Behold there was a man that was dying, so Seamus touched him and made him well.

27.Everyone was amazed and converted.

28.So they asked him to stay or a while.

Seamus 5

1.He then went to the town square, and saw that people were praying to a false god.

2.He told them, “Why worship false god when you know that the light is true.

3.“For the light is the only way to happiness.

4.“For false gods only give you lies and false hope.

5.“But the light is the truth, and only gives the truth.

6.“It ask you to convert, but not by force”.

7.They were so amazed that they all converted.

8.Behold there was a fireplace that had not had a flame for many years.

9.However, there was many homeless wandering around, looking for warmth.

10.Therefore, Seamus asked Samson to light the fire with his powers.

11.But Samson answered, “I am not powerful to do such a thing, I am not worthy”.

12.Nevertheless, Seamus was sad of what Samson said, so he replied,

13.“Within the eyes if the light, we are all worthy to gain powers he has.

14.“For everyone, even me, is at the same level, we all have something to learn”.

15.So Samson was comforted and used his powers to light the fire.

16.Seamus then said, “The light calls for me in Portsmouth (which was a sea side town to the north)”.

17.Therefore, he began to travel to Portsmouth.

18.And one the road was a man of dark powers saying, “He is the light’s slave, Seamus”.

19.For Seamus was sad, he said with all his heart, “I’m and not a slave but a free man.

20.“And for everyone to hear, the only ones who are slaves are the ones of give their lives to false gods.

21.“Curse those who do”.

22.So he took the dark powers from him and sent him on his way.

23.And when he got to Portmouth, he found that there was a house on fire.

24.He told Max and Rebecca to use their waterpowers to stop the fire.

25.Once the fire was out, He got Zeke and Sally to help him cure those who were hurt by the fire,

26.And to bring life back to the land.

27.Once he was done there, he went, for he said that there was work to do back in Boston.

Seamus 6

1.Behold, as he came back to Boston, there was a crowd waiting to be taught by Seamus.

2.Therefore, he got his followers to sit them down.

3.So spoke to them, saying, “Bless all, for they all are worthy for the light.

4.“For the light needs no cost, but the cost of wellbeing.

5.“For the light would gather see you happy, then staving for a false god.

6.“Behold the light see all as high as itself”.

7.Therefore, they were amazed, but most were homeless and cold.

8.In addition, they were hungry, for they had no food.

9.Therefore, Seamus got the money got from people from the road and brought bread for everyone.

10.As a witness, he used no power, but the power of his heart.

11.In those days, there was a man dark spirits named Seth,

12.For he bowed down to a dark spirit who claimed to be a god.

13.And Seth wanted Seamus dead, for the dark spirit said so.

14.When Seamus heard that his army was going to attacked him and kill him while he left to New York,

15.He was forced to go back to Albany.

16.Once he arrived, the light told him to go to the mountain of Stratton.

17.For Seamus had to climb the mountain, to show his followers that he was of the light.

18.So he, Samson and Max climbed the mountain, all others where of fear and though Seamus would die there.

19.So when reach the top, he told Max and Samson this,

20.“For only you came with me, for I will give leadership for when I pass, for which will come.

21.“For many want to kill me and I don’t think I will last the rest of the journey.

22.“Let yourself be prophets now”.

23.And they left the mountain.

24.When they came down, all were amazed, for where once felled with fear,

25.And they didn’t understand, so they asked Seamus and he answered,

26.“Don’t fears, for only they of false gods should fear”.

27.And they were amazed.

28.And they left to go back to Albany, to teach the Albanians.

Seamus 7

1.When he came to the Albany, the light warned him not to enter, so he went to Hartford.

2.As he exited the city, a man of air, converted by Gareth, came up to him and asked,

3.“What happens when we die?”

4.Seamus answered with, “For as the light showed me, life.

5.“For when you die, you are reborn,

6.“But if you refuse the light for darkness, you will not get another life,

7.“And you life will be no more.

8.“Those who doubt will last once more and those who are slaves will once more”.

9.Therefore, when they heard this, they were amazed of his teachings.

10.He then came to New York, for in those days, New Years was near,

11.And Seamus wanted to celebrate it there.

12.So on the day, he got his followers to go into the park where they listened to Seamus,

13.Which he spoke, “Behold the light gives us good news, for the sun will rise again!

14.“I warn you thought that there are men who still give up their lives to a lie.

15.“For I will save them, starting tomorrow I will go.

16.“For when the light has been told to everyone who your slaves, the world will be free.

17.“But I must say that the Buddhists don’t need converting, for they have their own light that has not slaved them.

18.“Make friends with them for they share the same beliefs, to make the world better.

19.“But for all else, they must convert”.

20.So on the next day, they traveled to Newark.

21.As Seamus entered the city, there was a child, hungry.

22.Seamus took the boy into the city and fed him, then giving him powers of earth.

23.He then sent the boy, who was called Sam, on his way.

Seamus 8

1.Behold there was man who claimed that Seamus was evil and they must kill him, he lefted, going to Philadelphia.

2.When, he arrived he said all that was around,

3.“I have good news, for the light has come.

4.“O Philadelphian, come and convert, fro the light comforts you”.

5.Many where converted but some hated him and wanted him dead.

6.Therefore, he left, heading for Baltimore.

7.On the road, behold Seth was, planning to test Seamus.

8.He said, “Why doesn’t the light stop the darkness, why get you to do it?”

9.Seamus answered, “The darkness is of our mistake, not the light.

10.“For the light is teaching us a lesson, making us sort out our own problems.

11.“The light only gives us powers to help us, but doesn’t do solve it for us.

12.“For we must solve our own problems”.

13.Seth lefted after that.

14.When they came to Baltimore, there was a man named Scott, who had been converted by Gareth,

15.For he needed an answer to a question he has which was,

16.“Who is the highest, you or Gareth?”

17.Seamus Answered with, “For within the eyes of the light, there is not highest.

18.“I am as high as you”.

19.Behold there was a river that had dried up,

20.Seamus was so sad he said, “O Max, leadership must be learnt, bring this river back to life so that people can drink again.

21.However, Rebecca tried to fell the river up but it did not work.

22.Seamus laughed.

23.He said to her, “You can make yourself look better, wait for your chance to prove your worth”.

24.Then, Max asked Rebecca to help him, so together, they did their main goal.

25.Seamus then spoke to them, saying, “There will come a time where our enemies will gain a leader.

26.“For they will get a helping hand who will test us, Judge us, and that the powers form our light.

27.“But don’t be afraid, for when this came, he light will send to us a man.

28.“For he will be one of them for a moment, but he will be curse.

29.“For he will have one good eye, and one evil eye.

30.“They will stab, what for us the evil, and print words of disgrace upon his head.

31.“For he will be our leader, the one who comes on behalf of the light.

32.“And when he creates, earthquakes and food loss, a false god will come down from the sky.

33.“Don’t be afraid for we will defeat them in time”.

Seamus 9

1.He then left for Annapolis, which he had longed to go to.

2.However, when he got there, Seth was planning to kill him, for he hated him.

3.Because of this, Seamus lefted for Washington.

4.When he got there, he found that many people where bowing down to false gods.

5.Seamus decided to show them the truth, which his followers warned him not to do,

6.For the ones who bowed would kill him.

7.Seamus said to them, showing the light,

8.“Keep yourselves from idols.

9.“But the light can save you, as he did for me.

10.“For there was once was a man who believed in his boss.

11.“But power went to the boss’s head, and he started to whip him.

12.“Then he made the man work so hard, he felt like dying.

13.“For this is what your false god is doing!

14.“Curse those who say that the light is a lie, for what you believe in is one of them”.

15.When they heard this, they began throwing rocks at him.

16.And on the road there was a tree that was dying,

17.For people where cutting it down.

18.Seamus, being angry yelled at them, saying,

19.“Wicked ones, why kill a life.

20.“For when the light makes your life no more, I will spit and curse you”.

21.Because of this, he and his followers had to run the whole way to Richmond.

22.When he got there, he went to the town square to teach them.

23.He said to them, “Behold, I send to you the light.

24.“For he light will give you happiness.

25.“For there was a man who said he was happy to work for his boss.

26.“he said, that he would die for his boss.

27.“When his boss kill his love, he had no choose but to still love his boss.

28.“Would you do that if you false god did that?”

29.They where so shocked at what he said, they told him to leave their city.

Seamus 10

1.When he got to Norfolk, there was a storm.

2.Therefore, Seamus told Harold to calm the storm.

3.Therefore, he did, and everyone there was afraid.

4.Behold there was men who were of dark spirit telling them that Seamus was the devil.

5.The people then tried to stone Seamus, but luckily, he was able to go out alive.

6.Behold there was a man from Seth, saying, “Come to Washington and we will see what is true, my god, or your light”.

7.But his followers warned him not to go, but he said that he wanted to go.

8.So when he got there, Seth was outside the city, waiting to see him.

9.Seth then took out a gun and said, “the light cant save you from this”.

10.And with one shot from the gun and Seamus was dead.

11.And all his followers ran for, it they could not believe what they had witnessed.

12.But when they came to at point they stopped for a rest.

13.And Max then said to them, “Lets us not give up now,

14.“For Seamus gave up his life for what his belief was, and we must carry on from there.

15.“For within us, we can do what Seamus wanted to do.

16.So they when back to New York.

17.For when they arrived, they got me to write down all that Seamus did and said,

18.For everyone can read it all.

19.Therefore, they split into four groups,

20.Water, fire, earth, air, all working as one.

21.Therefore, they went everywhere, telling of the light.

22.And with the light as their guide, they were felled with joy and happiness.

Also The Book Of Jake, for those mentioned here are very brave:

Jake 1

1.In the town of Philadelphia, we battled the light, oh Zeke powerful.

2.And as it was, Milo of Water, Sylvia of Earth, Jake of Fire, and many others,

3.Formed and an army.

4.And so as it was, there was an old warehouse, which had once been used by us, the homeless,

5.But had been taken over by the dark ones.

6.So Milo of Water, Sylvia of Earth, and Jake of Fire went to the old warehouse,

7.And Jake of Fire chanted:

8.“Fires from the great light, destroy my enemies, for they are not of the you light.

9.“Let them have painful deaths, let them pled for another life,

10.“Let their skin fall from their bodies, for they are evil.

11.“Let their lives be no more, for they are no need of one.

12.“Be gone of them not, for the dark ones only do what is bad”.

13.And so as it was, the building went up in flames.

14.While it was up in flames, a dark one found them, for he had escaped.

15.And it was Sylvia, who was the best at this, chanted:

16.“The light command of the darkness,

17.“Be gone, for you need not you, for you evil is not welcome.

18.“May you never some back, for evermore”

19.And as it was, the spirit left his body.

20.And from that day one, he followed the light.

21.Then Milo of Water chanted:

22.“Be wet, old building.

23.“Let it rain, so that we can dance in it is weather.

24.“Let it drop upon my n*** body.

25.“Let it drown out my sorrow, oh light”.

26.And it began to rain all around Philadelphia, making the fire go away.

27.Sylvia then chanted:

28.“Let life come back to where it once was.

29.“Let the light shine over it for one more time”.

30.And the building went back to what it was before.

31.They then entered the building, finding all that was there dead.

32.They called others to come.

Jake 2

1.And those who came:

2.Chris of Air, Daniel of Air, Peter of Air, Jackson of Air,

3.Milo of Fire, Seamus of Fire, Caleb of Fire, Liam of Fire,

4.Sarah of Water, Zack of Water, Katie of Water, Ricky of Water,

5.Cain of Earth, Vicky of Earth, Jenny of Earth, and Milo of Earth.

6.And Chris chanted:

7.“Let these body go away from this place,

8.“Let them never return to this world again”.

9.And the bodies were gone of this world.

10.Behold, the old warehouse was surrounded by the darkness,

11.For the darkness wanted it back.

12.So as it was, they fought of the darkness,

13.For there was number of one hundred and sixty dark ones there.

14.And when the darkness fled, it left a plan,

15.Which was to build a wall of darkness around the city of Philadelphia.

16.And Sylvia and I went to where the darkness was hiding.

17.And with our powers, we chanted:

18.“Be gone of this world, for this wall is not needed”

19.But their powers were too strong.

20.And we saw around the city, the wall appeared around the city.

21.But it was only to those of the light and the darkness that saw it.

22.And we chanted even stronger:

23.“Be gone of this world, for this wall is not needed

24.“Let this wall, be no more”.

25.And with that, wall went, and so with the darkness that is around us, and of this city.

26.I, Jake of Fire, tell you Zeke the powerful, that the light has saved us Philadelphian,

27.From the Darkness, for now we are free.

28.Let the light shine on Philadelphia forevermore!

And finally The First Letter Of Max:

1 Max 1

1.Max of Water, a student of Seamus, and a teacher of water.

2.I have sent Sally to you to teach you all of her powers.

3.Harold will come to you after new years day.

4.I will hope he will teach you of the way of air.

5.And with that, you can talk to those with that power in California.

6.I have heard of many great prophets with the powers of air,

7.All in which are Californians.

8.Here, in the east, there are none,

9.No one who knows of the air.

10.I know that I am if water, yet air is what I study also.

11.I learnt many things from Harold, for he is as strong as I.

12.I promote him then as Air Master,

13.As I am Water Master,

14.And Gareth is Fire Master, which got the title from Seamus himself.

15.Many people have asked me how to focus.

16.I will them tell them.

17.To focus, you must be one with the world.

18.Secondly, you must understand your surroundings.

19.This means your eyes must be closed.

20.With focus, the darkness can be defeated, and can allow you to see.

21.With in the darkness, light can be seen.

22.Even if the normal light can come, the true light can.

23.Let the light be your guide.

24.Let it move you feet,

25.And control your hands.

26.With the light as your guide, nothing can defeat you.

27.Let the light be with you always.

1 Max 2

1.Let no darkness come.

2.Let the light enter your body, within your mind.

3.It will correct all the wrong that you have done.

4.And with it, all darkness should go.

5.And with focus, you power will be greater than Earth,

6.Greater than Air, even though it to is strong,

7.Greater than Fire, no matter how strong it is,

8.Greater than Water, for focus is a new kind of power, different yet with water,

9.And finally greater than Darkness.

10.Nothing is greater than light, because it is everything.

11.The last time I came to you, focus was not known to you.

12.Seamus never knew about it.

13.But the light gave the understanding of it.

14.So I come to tell all of it.

15.For I am know in Paterson, teaching everyone of this Focus,

16.For it can come with any power.

17.It is greater then any power other than light.

18.Let I give you a chant to help you, for that I cannot come to you.

19.“Light is great, darkness is not,

20.“Focus is great, all else is lesser,

21.“Other than the light that is given to us”.

22.Focus is a main part in Isurak now.

23.I even gave Harold a lesson in it, so that his air powers where gained on.

24.He admitted to it being great.

25.I hope you think the same thing.

1 Max 3

1.I now know that there are some that are coming to destroy us.

2.I now if we are strong, we can over come these evil.

3.Let all of the dark spirits go away.

4.People have asked why I have never tried to convert people.

5.I answer that I am the type of focus on the quality of a person,

6.Not having many.

7.I have kept to having a few students, all in which were converted by Seamus.

8.I have none in which I have converted.

9.I have never converted anyone before.

10.People have said that I am a disgrace,

11.That I need to do the light’s job.

12.But isn’t it the light’s job to focus on his converts as well.

13.I am here as a teacher, not as a converter.

14.There are who come to convert, but I am not one of them.

15.There are people who fight for the light, but I am not one of them.

16.What I am is a teacher, to give people lessons about the light.

17.For those who disagree with me, let him disagree with me.

18.I have no troubles for it.

19.For as Gareth once said:

20.“Life is to be questioned”.

21.As he promoted question our faith, I do as well.

22.If there are no questions, there are no improvements.

23.If you want answers, you must question.

24.Because time is short, I must come to an end.

25.And with that, I must travel to New York to be with the other six.

26.So farewell, O followers of the light.

12/7/2007 #4
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52
This is a joke, right?
2/7/2008 #5
Kaleb-of-Sand
No, this is all true. Convert and be saved.
2/9/2008 #6
Incorporeal
So, uh.... What exactly do you believe, again?
3/5/2008 #7
He Has Risen
Yea.... is this about the second coming, or a totally new religion.....

It confuzzles me.

3/10/2008 #8
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

I am fairly confident this is not about the Second Coming. This guy is a major wacko. He believes in becoming our own gods, "the power of the earth", and other heretical nonsense.

4/24/2008 #9
Kaleb-of-Sand

Heretics is a word used by gods to keep its followers as slave. Do not be fooled by them.

5/8/2008 #10
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

Do you feel the same way about spelling and grammar, troll?

5/13/2008 #11
NeverGirl

So, really, you do believeall of this, or is this some whacked-out social experiment to see if you can get people to believe this? And, er, if you really do believe this, where'd you get all of the gospels and whatnot? And, well, have you gotten a psychological evaluation lately...?

5/29/2008 #12
CS Waters

Um, Kaleb-of-Sand, when you say gods keep followers as slaves, don't you think that's a little of center there? Your whole religion is based on serving the light, correct? Well, when you serve someone, you can sometimes make them your god when you serve them without another word.

Then if that is true, and you serve the light, you are making it your god, imprisoning you within it.

I am only familar with one God, and He would never force me into anything I don't want to do. He gave me free will so I may freely follow in His ways. Only a Loving Father would do that. I do not agree with your god, nor will I save your god.

I am quite content in following a God Who will never forsaken me, Who can move mountains, and Who sent His Perfect Son down, humbled Him, and died on the cross in the most gursome way. Surely that means something to you.

Hard core atheists have tried time and time again to prove Christianity as false. And time and time again they have been proven wrong and have become the strongest Christians ever.

Now surely that must mean something. I have more evidence that Christianity and Judism (which is Christianity without Jesus) are true and are the way.

7/11/2008 #13
Kaleb-of-Sand

Do not believe that, for it is all a lie. There is proof of the light, and none of you religion. Firstly, the planets, the Bible never mention them, yet the planets are there. The bible disproves evolution, yet it exists. You say that you Jesus was sent down here to save, yet the light tells us that Jesus made us slaves of you false god. I am my own god. The light has guided me to that truth. Now I am free. Convert, and you will discover the same thing.

7/14/2008 #14
CS Waters

I will not convert. You are not free, because you are now enslaved by the Devil and his tricks. In the bible, Corinthians 11:14, "satan disguises himself as an angel of light."

The Devil uses our own minds to trick us. God has proven time and time again Who He is. Why, if you were think carefully, why do miracles (like rising from the dead) and others casting out demons. I have personally seen the power of Christ. He is on the move. I would rather serve a loyal, all-knowing, all-seeing, Loving, merciful, and all powerful God than serve myself, for I am not any of those things.

You fool yourself when you call yourself a god. You are not a god, and soon you will see it for yourself. I am not threating you, but merely pointing out what God had done before so many times before. 'Pride comes before the fall', a wise man once said.

Sure the Bible does not speak of evolution or other planets, but both exist. In Genesis, God created both the heavens and the earth. Many people in ancient times used the term heavens to describe stars.

Many Christians, including Darwin (who was a Christian), believe in evolution. You confuse yourself when you claim an ancient fact like that. Evolution and other planets are all of God's creation.

Many great scientists, if I must remind you, were Christians. And if you look deep into the Bible's prophecies, you will discover that most of its prophecies have come true. The Bible last for well over 2,000 years and more (if you count the Torah). It was burned, forbidden, and people got killed over it. Yet here today it is, with over 25,000 copies of it world wide, which is much greater than over 5,000 which is Homer's Iliad.

Your light is not a light at all, but a dark shadow that blinds you in the ways of God. Did your light create the universe? Did your light give your rules and bountaries to follow? Did your light guide and protect hundreds of thousands of people all at once? Is your light all knowing and all powerful?

7/14/2008 #15
Kaleb-of-Sand

A lier you are. Your false God is telling you lies. The bible we see today is only a small piece of what it was 2000 years ago. It has been changed, so that it will be able to control you like slaves. The light is not what you cal the devil. The darkness is what your false god and false devil are. All of it is lies.

7/14/2008 #16
CS Waters

Very well, have it your way. But I will not covert. I will stay at my God's side no matter what. I see I cannot convince you, nor should I even try.

Good bye, Kaleb-of-Sand. I wish the best will happen to you. May God bless you in many ways.

7/15/2008 #17
Kaleb-of-Sand

Have you not read what Harold has to say on the matters of the end. If you do not convert, bad things will happen to you:

Harold 1

The visions of Harold as follows, Guarded by Seamus to the complete light: Behold, when Max was shot, we hid from Seth, Fearing his rage. I stand among them, scared. We stabbed our hands, to let the pain go away, And with that, I slept. Behold the first vision, oh Rebecca of Ice, How great you are, How lovely you are, How sad it is to say goodbye: So it was, I saw two mountains, higher than the sky, looking down at me. What a great sight it was, how great to see it, with my visions. And as it was, a light came down from the sky, and landed in the middle. And with that, two lights brighten the two mountaintops. And then I saw four men standing in the mist. The first man, who wore green, said: “I am the beginning, the grower of the world, “I set the world to work, for I love it so. “I am the sun, the moon, the stars, and the earth you stand on, I am everything. “I live within you, I am you, and I am the creator of what is. “I am you, I am they, and I am I. “I am the believer, the light, and the world upon. “What I am, I am” Behold the second man spoke, which wore blue: “I am the river, running free. “I am the ocean, great waves collide within me. “I am the sea, seven in which covers our land. “I am the fish, breathing me, living me, they are me, as I am they. “I am the water, for it is great, I covers the world. “What I am, I am”.

Harold 2

Behold the third man spoke, which wore yellow: “I am the mountain, breathing the air. “I am the wind, the breeze of the world. “I am the sky, with stars covering my face at night. “I am the air that we breathe, I bring life into this world and lets it be. “What I am, I am”. And behold the fourth man spoke, for he wore red: “I am the fire place, for I give warmth. “I am the wildness, for I give a reason to live. “I am the anger within us, waiting to defend us. “What I am, I am”. And behold within the mist, man in black appeared, whom said, “I am death. “I am not the living, but to take what is living. “And then I bring you back to your next life, “If the light chooses, that is. “What I am, I am”. And behold, a man came from the sky. He wore white, but I knew he had not come from which he had. And he said, “I am the Alpha and the Omega”. And as if was, many people came pass me, all chained, For the man in white had did such a thing. He made them work for a false god, lie to them. As that is when I woke up.

Harold 3

The next day, I talked to Gareth, for he had come back from the west. He told me that what I saw was what is to come. So I stabbed my hands again the next night, and again I saw the same dream, But when I got to the part that I had woke up the night before, some else happened. I saw a battle between things above in the sky. I saw to men in the sky, one of them was the man in white, fighting. And then I saw a river come below. It had a great fish come down it. Twenty-seven smaller fish followed it. And behold a tree appeared for it had apples on it. Behold there was a voice which said, “Do not eat” But I don’t follow anyone but myself, So I ate apple and I saw in front of me Seamus. He said, “By the great of the light, stay low. “Be great, never bad. “Hard times will come, but through them you will go. “Keep to the code the light laid out to you, as what I said in my chants, “And you will be saved. “Tell this to Rebecca, there is no greater. “Tell her be true. “Gareth, don’t go back to where you once came. “Visit the west once more, for your life is coming to a end. “Beware of her, for she did not die. “For she spat on you, laughed at you, “Looked down on you. “What I am, I am”.

7/16/2008 #18
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

Where I come from, we have a word for this: "Stupid." What exactly are you preaching? What is this "light"? Why can't you spell? Who was "Seamus" and what was he smoking?

9/4/2008 #19
Leana C

Here are some questions: Why do we have to be saved? Isn't it enough that we are good people? Why do we have to give up most of our beliefs for a religion?

1/10/2009 #20
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

Unfortunately, no. It's not enough that you are a "good person". Let me explain why(from a Christian perspective, not this dolt's).

Put yourself in God's position. You are an all-powerful, omniscient, holy being who created a perfect heaven, filled with perfect angels, and a perfect earth, filled with perfect animals and perfect people. Everything is perfect; there is no drought, no famine, no war, no death, no sadness. You have given your earthly creations one command, however, which is not to eat the fruit of a certain tree. Doesn't seem like a lot to ask, right?

Well, then your most beautiful angel leads a rebellion of one-third of the heavenly host, and, to keep heaven perfect, you kick him out. After that, he tricks your human creations into transgressing your one command. Unfortunately, earth is no longer perfect. You also cannot let them into heaven, for if an imperfect person, stained with sin, got into heaven, heaven would no longer be perfect.

But you still love your human children. You love them so much that you are willing to sacrifice yourself to pay the price for their sins, and, if they let you, to make them perfect so they can get into heaven. But you love them too much to override their wills and force them to allow you into their lives, however, so you make yourself known as best you can without completely overwhelming them, and you hope that they will answer your call.

It pains you, but those who do not accept you cannot be allowed into heaven.

Enya Black, no matter how good you are, you are not perfect. At least once in your life, you lied, cheated, stole or murdered. Or perhaps you committed some other sin. Because of that, the bad news is, you cannot go to heaven unless you are purified and your sin is paid for. The good news is that your sin has been paid for, and God will purify you if you only ask him.

1/11/2009 #21
Leana C

Oh, sorry. Those questions weren't for you. It was for this idiot.

1/12/2009 #22
Leana C

Enlighten my Kaleb, why should I join this light thing? Why should I have to be saved by the likes of you, one who types like a brainwashing zombie?

1/12/2009 #23
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

Oh, sorry. Those questions weren't for you. It was for this idiot.

I know, but your position about "being a good person" still needed to be answered.

1/14/2009 #24
Leana C

No matter what, I still think that all one needs to be is a good person to be loved by God. I never said I was perfect, or that anyone who was good is perfect, but they still shouldn't have to give up everything they believe in for another religion when they are already good enough for heaven. They can still believe in God, or whatever Supreme Being, be a good person and not have to go to a religion. They don't need a religion to have faith.

And if they don't believe in God (or anything else for that matter), then so what? If they are good people then they should be fine. I highly doubt that God would send a good person to hell because they didn't believe in Him. Do you think He is biased? They will probably immediately believe once they see Him, and that should be enough.

Also, He loves us all unconditionally, despite our faults. Unless we deny Him completely, good people who have sinned in the past and felt remorse would still have the chance to go to Heaven. We shouldn't have to convert to a religion to have the right to believe in Him. Unconditional love doesn't require one to go through an unwanting change. God doesn't have to make us change our ways, and He will accept us even if we don't convert. We don't have to be "perfect" to enter God's Kingdom.

I may have been born a Catholic, but once I turn eighteen I'm giving up religion all together. It's not necessary. That doesn't mean I will give up on God. I still believe in Him, because we all had to start from somewhere, but I won't join another religion, do any of the religious rituals, or listen to another priests' sermons.

I also won't read the Bible, because that is just a book that doesn't have any facts to back it up. You mentioned Adam and Eve before, but that is from the Old Testament. It was a story passed down orally and written by the Hebrews. The apostles? The same thing. They wrote the New Testament, not Jesus himself. Man is what wrote the Bible, but not God. As far as I'm concerned, that book is fiction until I hear it from the Creator Himself.

And to all of you who think that those who think anyone, who either doesn't believe in God, or aren't in your religion, is a "victim": Who do you people think you are? Do you have any idea how condescending people sound when they regard anyone who isn't Christian, or part of another religion, a victim? Or worse, when they look at someone who is, say a Wiccan and they think "Satan worshipper"? And what gives you the right to try and convert them so their "souls are saved," when they don't need it? Who are you to say that your religion is the "right one," and that anyone who isn't part of it is going to go to hell unless they join?

If any of you have tried to convert another person because you think their souls need saving, then you are no better then Kaleb-of-Sand.

There is no right or wrong religion. Religions are just a belief structure to give people peace of mind. If you want to join them, fine, but don't try to convert whoever you think needs "saving." Don't close yourself off to, or look down on anyone who is another religion. Jesus accepted everyone, and when he was on Earth it wasn't his intention to create another religion. For all you know, the deities that people from different religions believe in are the same Being. We should all just live with each other's beliefs peacefully, because though our beliefs may be different, we are all the same. We all have an equal chance of going into Heaven by genuine faith and goodness towards one another.

I honestly didn't mean for this to end up as a full on rant essay. This is just my opinion, and I honestly believe in all this. In God's eyes, a soul's religion/beliefs shouldn't matter. The person's character should be what is most important. Also, if any of you are anything like I described two paragraphs up, I apologize if you are offended, but you should probably think about what I said (typed).

1/15/2009 #25
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

No matter what, I still think that all one needs to be is a good person to be loved by God. I never said I was perfect, or that anyone who was good is perfect, but they still shouldn't have to give up everything they believe in for another religion when they are already good enough for heaven. They can still believe in God, or whatever Supreme Being, be a good person and not have to go to a religion. They don't need a religion to have faith.

Actually, you are wrong on all counts. Both good and bad people are loved by God. Your statement that people are "already good enough for heaven", however, is incorrect and rests on a subjective definition of "good". Let me ask you, just exactly how "good" does one need to be to get into heaven? Mother Theresa was probably good enough, Gandhi was probably good enough, Hitler was probably not good enough, but what about Joe Schmoe, who's never really done much good or evil? Is he good enough? Is good more than just the absence of bad? These are things you need to ask yourself, if you truly believe as you say you do.

And if they don't believe in God (or anything else for that matter), then so what? If they are good people then they should be fine. I highly doubt that God would send a good person to hell because they didn't believe in Him. Do you think He is biased? They will probably immediately believe once they see Him, and that should be enough.

But it's not just because they didn't believe in him. It's because, by not believing, they rejected his offer of forgiveness, which would have allowed them into heaven.

I also won't read the Bible, because that is just a book that doesn't have any facts to back it up. You mentioned Adam and Eve before, but that is from the Old Testament. It was a story passed down orally and written by the Hebrews. The apostles? The same thing. They wrote the New Testament, not Jesus himself. Man is what wrote the Bible, but not God. As far as I'm concerned, that book is fiction until I hear it from the Creator Himself.

NO facts to back it up?

There are plenty of facts to back up the Bible. Whole websites full. Here are just a few to get you started. Look over these, then come back:

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a011.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a007.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a009.html

In particular, note that a worldwide flood is described in the legends of cultures from all around the world, including Babylon, Greece, and American Indian tribes; cultures that had no known contact. Interesting, huh? Furthermore, my Adam and Eve argument works as long as you accept that humans do things God has commanded them not to; regardless of whether Adam and Eve actually existed.

And to all of you who think that those who think anyone, who either doesn't believe in God, or aren't in your religion, is a "victim": Who do you people think you are? Do you have any idea how condescending people sound when they regard anyone who isn't Christian, or part of another religion, a victim? Or worse, when they look at someone who is, say a Wiccan and they think "Satan worshipper"? And what gives you the right to try and convert them so their "souls are saved," when they don't need it? Who are you to say that your religion is the "right one," and that anyone who isn't part of it is going to go to hell unless they join?

No one. I am no one to say that. But Jesus Christ is. As far as them not needing it, that is your personal opinion, backed up with no more facts than anything I have said. In fact, it is backed up with none. What gives me the right to try and convert them? I could as easily ask you what gives you the right to harbor ill-will toward me for doing so.

If any of you have tried to convert another person because you think their souls need saving, then you are no better then Kaleb-of-Sand.

Them's fightin' words.

Seriously, though, we are better than Kaleb-of-Sand, even if our beliefs are incorrect(which they're not). We are better than him because we are attempting to help God save people like you, because we love you. But more importantly, God loves you. He is spamming, and trying simply to tick people off. I will concede he's had some success. Also, we can spell.

I honestly didn't mean for this to end up as a full on rant essay. This is just my opinion, and I honestly believe in all this. In God's eyes, a soul's religion/beliefs shouldn't matter. The person's character should be what is most important. Also, if any of you are anything like I described two paragraphs up, I apologize if you are offended, but you should probably think about what I said (typed).

As a final note, stop talking about what God should be. This is only conjecture on your part. Instead, you should do your best to determine who He is.

1/15/2009 #26
Leana C

Actually, you are wrong on all counts. Both good and bad people are loved by God. Your statement that people are "already good enough for heaven", however, is incorrect and rests on a subjective definition of "good". Let me ask you, just exactly how "good" does one need to be to get into heaven? Mother Theresa was probably good enough, Gandhi was probably good enough, Hitler was probably not good enough, but what about Joe Schmoe, who's never really done much good or evil? Is he good enough? Is good more than just the absence of bad? These are things you need to ask yourself, if you truly believe as you say you do.

Technically, all humans are good, because God only makes good things. Humans just do bad things, and they will be by God for that. I may not like His decision, but I will still trust that He makes the right judgement for each person. As for Joe Schmoe, if he's never done anything wrong, then why should he go to hell? He's still good, because humans are good.

But it's not just because they didn't believe in him. It's because, by not believing, they rejected his offer of forgiveness, which would have allowed them into heaven.

How would they reject His offer of forgiveness if they never heard or acknowledged it? See, I see the Atheists' argument when it comes to God. They have a hard time believing He's there because they rely on their senses. If they can't see it or touch it, then to them it isn't real. If He is the compassionate Being we know He is, God would understand that and automatically forgive them. Besides, I said that many of those people would believe when they see Him after death. You can't just have them believe automatically through faith and religion. Faith has to be a gradual process that can't be forced. And if they don't learn it before death, then they will when they see God.

NO facts to back it up?

There are plenty of facts to back up the Bible. Whole websites full. Here are just a few to get you started. Look over these, then come back:

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a011.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a007.html

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-abr/abr-a009.html

I'm not denying that most of the historical events that took place in the Bible is untrue, but all the stories such as Noah's Ark and Adam and Eve were the Hebrew version of fairy tales. It was the same with the Greeks; ever hear the story of Pandora's Box? That is just another version of Adam and Eve, where it was implied that women helped caused the evils in the world. Guess who made it that way? MEN! Not God. Men! And you know what? Anything could have caused Soddom and Gemorah to fall, it didn't have to be God's wrath. Either way, your "facts" were created by humans, not God. I want to hear the truth from Him.

In particular, note that a worldwide flood is described in the legends of cultures from all around the world, including Babylon, Greece, and American Indian tribes; cultures that had no known contact. Interesting, huh?

Well, duh! Floods just don't take place in one country. Many of those stories were before the Age of Exploration, when the once vast world began to look smaller. To many of those cultures their own country was "the world," because they didn't know much outside of it, except possibly for perhaps trading ports. You say that these cultures didn't have contact with one another, but you are wrong. In those trading ports, cultures would spread their ideas wherever they went. Also, no one knew of tectonic plates or any of the other causes of natural disasters, so they had to explain them through stories about gods, or other Supreme Beings.

Furthermore, my Adam and Eve argument works as long as you accept that humans do things God has commanded them not to; regardless of whether Adam and Eve actually existed.

God can't command humans. He gave us free will, remember that. We all have the ability to make a choice. And I highly doubt that if there was an Adam or an Eve they were the only people on the planet, as the Bible seems to suggest. I also highly doubt that the world was created in seven days, like the Old Testament said.

No one. I am no one to say that. But Jesus Christ is. As far as them not needing it, that is your personal opinion, backed up with no more facts than anything I have said. In fact, it is backed up with none. What gives me the right to try and convert them? I could as easily ask you what gives you the right to harbor ill-will toward me for doing so.

Jesus didn't intend to start a religion, he wanted people to have their sins be forgiven. He wanted people to achieve peace with each other and within themselves. And he didn't wait for them to ask to be forgiven, he did it anyway. He also didn't judge others. He wasn't asking them to convert from Judaism to Christianity. Christianity is the unintentional result of the Apostles preaching about Jesus' philosophy and that he had resurrected. They wanted to do what Jesus did while keeping true to their Jewish faith, not start a whole other movement. But it happened anyway.

I don't really have to back it up with facts because it's common sense. God loves all of us no matter what; converting to a religion isn't required when there is already faith and peacefulness in the person. Why convert those who don't need it? Shouldn't they have a say on whether they want it or not? Better yet, wouldn't it be better for people to come to you willingly, without you telling them that their "souls will be saved" if they join? Last I checked, Jesus had people come to him willingly, not due to him saying "you will burn in hell if you don't," like how most people say it now.

We are better than him because we are attempting to help God save people like you, because we love you. But more importantly, God loves you. He is spamming, and trying simply to tick people off. I will concede he's had some success. Also, we can spell.

Hold that thought:

To Kaleb-of-sand: I apologize for my rudeness. You are not an idiot and you don't need help or spiritual guidance. If your part of another religion that's fine. I just don't like it when people want me to convert to something when I feel I don't need to. I apologize and wish you luck with your religion.

To Lord of The Marsh: Ha! You contradicted yourself buddy! See, because you are like Kaleb more than you think. The two of you both think that you are helping both your respective Deities to save "people like me" because you "love me." The both of you think the same way, when it comes to converting, or "saving" people. For all you know, he's probably serious about his religion just like you are, and for all you know your religions might have some similarities. Neither of you two are from a wrong or right religion. It's just a religion that gives you peace of mind.

And that's fine, really. If you both are at peace with the way you are, fine. Just don't try to convert me like I need "saving." My soul will be fine without either of your help, thank you very much.

And oh no--he can't spell! Honestly, what does that have to do with anything? I mean, I can understand when it comes to writing down a story, but it's not relevant.

As a final note, stop talking about what God should be. This is only conjecture on your part. Instead, you should do your best to determine who He is.

As a final note: Try questioning your religion for a change. There are a lot of things you might find need some speculation. Also, when your teacher starts talking about the Enlightenment ideas, pay attention. You might start freeing yourself.

And I'm not talking about how God should be. I'm talking about how He is.

Peace out.

1/15/2009 #27
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

Technically, all humans are good, because God only makes good things. Humans just do bad things, and they will be by God for that. I may not like His decision, but I will still trust that He makes the right judgement for each person. As for Joe Schmoe, if he's never done anything wrong, then why should he go to hell? He's still good, because humans are good.

Oh, he's done wrong things. Just not enough to make him consider himself evil. He thinks he's basically a good person. I mean, sure, maybe he tells a white lie here and there, maybe he sometimes neglects to give credit to others so he'll look better, but at least he's not starting wars, right? He's never murdered anybody, right?

How would they reject His offer of forgiveness if they never heard or acknowledged it? See, I see the Atheists' argument when it comes to God. They have a hard time believing He's there because they rely on their senses. If they can't see it or touch it, then to them it isn't real. If He is the compassionate Being we know He is, God would understand that and automatically forgive them. Besides, I said that many of those people would believe when they see Him after death. You can't just have them believe automatically through faith and religion. Faith has to be a gradual process that can't be forced. And if they don't learn it before death, then they will when they see God.

I am unfortunately not knowledgeable enough to speak for those who genuinely never heard of Jesus. I believe, however, that if you seek, you will find. If you look up in the sky, and feel the awe of the Creator, even if you don't have any idea who He is, He will show Himself to you in some way or another. But most of the people of whom you speak have heard of Him, and tacitly reject Him by not accepting Him.

I'm not denying that most of the historical events that took place in the Bible is untrue, but all the stories such as Noah's Ark and Adam and Eve were the Hebrew version of fairy tales. It was the same with the Greeks; ever hear the story of Pandora's Box? That is just another version of Adam and Eve, where it was implied that women helped caused the evils in the world. Guess who made it that way? MEN! Not God. Men! And you know what? Anything could have caused Soddom and Gemorah to fall, it didn't have to be God's wrath. Either way, your "facts" were created by humans, not God. I want to hear the truth from Him.

It is unreasonable to demand that God speak to you directly and audibly before you will believe anything. My facts were not "created" by humans, merely pointed out by them.

I'm not denying that most of the historical events that took place in the Bible is untrue,

I assume you mean "true", not untrue?

As far as S*** and Gomorrah are concerned, sure, anything could have caused them to fall, if it was not known that all the buildings in both cities burned to the ground from the roof down. There are few likely causes for this besides God's wrath.

Well, duh! Floods just don't take place in one country. Many of those stories were before the Age of Exploration, when the once vast world began to look smaller. To many of those cultures their own country was "the world," because they didn't know much outside of it, except possibly for perhaps trading ports. You say that these cultures didn't have contact with one another, but you are wrong. In those trading ports, cultures would spread their ideas wherever they went. Also, no one knew of tectonic plates or any of the other causes of natural disasters, so they had to explain them through stories about gods, or other Supreme Beings.

Let's start by examining your premise here. First you say that "Floods just don't take place in one country.", presumably meaning you believe all the Flood stories came from different floods, and that each of these cultures thought their country was the whole world. Then you go on to say that these cultures had contact at trading ports and spread their ideas. However, if these cultures had contact, that would rule out your first theory. Furthermore, it is doubtful there was any contact between the Mediterranean and Native American cultures prior to the 15th or 16th centuries.

God can't command humans. He gave us free will, remember that. We all have the ability to make a choice. And I highly doubt that if there was an Adam or an Eve they were the only people on the planet, as the Bible seems to suggest. I also highly doubt that the world was created in seven days, like the Old Testament said.

Sure he can. You have free will, but I can command you to do whatever I want. You won't obey, but I can command.

I don't really have to back it up with facts because it's common sense. God loves all of us no matter what; converting to a religion isn't required when there is already faith and peacefulness in the person. Why convert those who don't need it? Shouldn't they have a say on whether they want it or not? Better yet, wouldn't it be better for people to come to you willingly, without you telling them that their "souls will be saved" if they join? Last I checked, Jesus had people come to him willingly, not due to him saying "you will burn in hell if you don't," like how most people say it now.

So facts are needed to back up the Bible, but anything you make up about God is holy ground as long as it seems to make sense?

Hold that thought:

To Kaleb-of-sand: I apologize for my rudeness. You are not an idiot and you don't need help or spiritual guidance. If your part of another religion that's fine. I just don't like it when people want me to convert to something when I feel I don't need to. I apologize and wish you luck with your religion.

To Lord of The Marsh: Ha! You contradicted yourself buddy! See, because you are like Kaleb more than you think. The two of you both think that you are helping both your respective Deities to save "people like me" because you "love me." The both of you think the same way, when it comes to converting, or "saving" people. For all you know, he's probably serious about his religion just like you are, and for all you know your religions might have some similarities. Neither of you two are from a wrong or right religion. It's just a religion that gives you peace of mind.

I didn't contradict myself, because I do not believe as you do that Kaleb is sincere but misguided. The fact that he disappeared when nobody fell for this nonsense is proof enough of that. I believe he is a spammer and a troll, as is Milo-of-Water.

And oh no--he can't spell! Honestly, what does that have to do with anything? I mean, I can understand when it comes to writing down a story, but it's not relevant.

Coming from an aspiring author, a contempt for spelling is frankly frightening.

It is relevant, as it shows that he is an idiot, especially given that there is a built-in spell check on these forums. Or, if not an idiot, then a person who does not care enough to correct his spelling. This person is hardly "serious".

As a final note: Try questioning your religion for a change. There are a lot of things you might find need some speculation. Also, when your teacher starts talking about the Enlightenment ideas, pay attention. You might start freeing yourself.

I have questioned my religion, and come up time and again with the same answer. My teacher has never spoken of the Enlightenment ideas, but I know enough of them. You do not believe them, for the Enlightenment philosophers generally rejected the existence of God.

And I'm not talking about how God should be. I'm talking about how He is.

Actually, you were:

And if they don't believe in God (or anything else for that matter), then so what? If they are good people then they should be fine. I highly doubt that God would send a good person to hell because they didn't believe in Him. Do you think He is biased? They will probably immediately believe once they see Him, and that should be enough.

Also, He loves us all unconditionally, despite our faults. Unless we deny Him completely, good people who have sinned in the past and felt remorse would still have the chance to go to Heaven. We shouldn't have to convert to a religion to have the right to believe in Him. Unconditional love doesn't require one to go through an unwanting change. God doesn't have to make us change our ways, and He will accept us even if we don't convert. We don't have to be "perfect" to enter God's Kingdom.

You also use the word "would" a lot. I didn't highlight that, but it pretty much falls in the same category.

You, too, have attempted to convert people. You try to hide it, but you want me to believe as you do; that God accepts people regardless of their faith, and that the Bible is fiction. You have tried to convince me of this. We're basically the same, then; just arguing for different beliefs.

As a final note:

Have you ever heard of Pascal's Wager?Look it up. If you substitute your position for the "no God" position in the original, you'll see, my beliefs are, at the very least, a better bet.

1/16/2009 #28
EMPTY EMPTY EMPTY52

If you still think Kaleb is/was serious, read this: http://www.fictionpress.com/s/2581672/1/Convert_To_The_Light

1/16/2009 #29
Leana C

It is relevant, as it shows that he is an idiot, especially given that there is a built-in spell check on these forums. Or, if not an idiot, then a person who does not care enough to correct his spelling. This person is hardly "serious".

Well I did mean to type that it wasn't necessarily relevant here in the forum, as long as the message got across to the people who read. That was a mistake on my part, sorry.

You, too, have attempted to convert people. You try to hide it, but you want me to believe as you do; that God accepts people regardless of their faith, and that the Bible is fiction. You have tried to convince me of this. We're basically the same, then; just arguing for different beliefs.

It wasn't really my intention to convert people, I am simply stating a fact about the bible being fiction. And just ranting about how many religions can be condescending to other religions. What is there to convert people to anyway? I'm giving up religion, so there's nothing to convert people to. But, yeah we're the same I guess that's true. I just hate it that other religious people think I "need saving" just because I'm not part of a religion. We are all equal, which means we all have an equal chance to enter heaven, no matter what we are.

The bible was a book that was written thousands of years ago, and it can be changed and edited every couple thousand years without people ever noticing the difference. Christians would still rely on it like it was written by God, when it wasn't. It was inspired by God, not written by Him. It isn't something that people should rely on in their daily life. Do you know that people once looked in the bible as a way to justify slavery? Or that women were looked down upon because of the sexism in the Old Testament? The bible is too vague and unreliable for one to base their views on. That is why I reject the bible and all other written religious documents (the Koran, Hindus Vedas, etc.). Although, I do like the New Testament more than the Old, I still won't know the truth until I meet God.

You do not believe them, for the Enlightenment philosophers generally rejected the existence of God.

Did you ever hear of deism? That is considered to be part of the Age of Enlightenment. Deists believed that God created the Earth, but He left us to take care of ourselves. They believed in God, but they also used reason in their beliefs. They also didn't regard the bible as infallible.

Granted, I don't associate myself with deism, but I prefer to think for myself and not what religions tell me to do and think. That's what the Enlightenment led to, people thinking for themselves without the need for religion. But if you can think for yourself while still being Christian, great for you.

But the point is that for me religion isn't necessary. I'm fine the way I am and I'm happy that God accepts me. If you want to stay in your religion fine, but just keep in mind that there are a lot of other religions out there and they can't all be wrong. Don't just assume that just because the person isn't Catholic/Christian, they need "saving" or that "they are going to hell because they aren't in my religion." If you aren't like that then fine, but there are plenty of people who have that narrow mindset. God still loves us all, no matter what religion we are.

1/16/2009 #30
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