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Tah the Trickster

Hi. My name is Tah and I'm pansexual. (Hi Tah!) /silliness

Anyways. To give some backstory, I've 'come out' as pansexual for several years now, and I seem to have a common occurrence happen whenever it happens. Once I explain what pansexuality is ('sort of like bisexuality, but a little broader; I wouldn't have a problem with transgenders/transsexuals' etc....) I often get this question: "Oh, so you've slept with a transgender/transsexual, then?" I answer 'no,' which only results in more questioning and occasionally, their final decision that "Oh, you're not really pansexual, then."

It seems to me that people (or at least people down here) think that your sexuality all depends on who you've slept with. Which... I really don't get. I mean, even Wikipedia will agree that your orientation doesn't necessarily have to do with sex; it can also have to do with emotional or romantic attraction. If it was purely sexual, wouldn't every virgin in the world be asexual, then? xD

I was just wondering if anyone had thoughts on this, or if any not-straight people had ever encountered that before. (It may just be one of the weird beliefs people hold about not-straight people here in the Bible belt, I don't know. x3)

4/24/2010 #1
Twelfth Night

You came out in the bible belt. Gutsy. Forget them. You don't have to have sex with someone to know you're attracted to them. They're just being ignorant is all.

4/25/2010 #2
Knightmare Elite

This could become an interesting topic if enough people jump on it. I try to educate myself on different sexualities. I'm still working on my first, and likely only, transsexual novel, which has taught me a great deal about what it means to be transgendered. Of course, I've only learned like 1% because to fully understand something so foreign you have to experience it on some level. No amount of nonfiction and documentaries and substitute interface with someone who is that sexuality.

Oh and I wouldn't trust Wikipedia all that much since it's all user submitted content. Most of what you see on there is factual but I could probably go in there and edit the pansexual entry to say it means a fetish for sleeping with African Elephants. :)

So yeah, I want to hear opinions on sexualities too.

4/25/2010 #3
Brenda Agaro

As a pansexual myself, I have experienced this as well. When I tell people my sexual orientation, some would ask me questions like "Are you a furry?" or "Have you done a threesome before?" The person you're in love with shouldn't matter, and sex shouldn't be a priority. I personally don't care if my girlfriend happens to be a boy, or a transsexual, I love her for who she is. But those are my thoughts.

Some people, unfortunately, are superficial (the belief that a man and woman are allowed to marry together for instance.)

4/26/2010 #4
Eskye

I'm a lesbian, and my best friend recently came out to me as pansexual. As someone who is rather obsessed with the sexual aspect of relationships, it has been rather difficult understanding that though she's not particular about gender, she doesn't care about sex. But I've been learning, and it certainly doesn't seem like a problem to me. I've always seen sexuality as what you'd rather be around and share your life with. I've always had a strong connection with women and though I grew up with all male friends, I know that I would never be able to connect with them on any higher level. That and I think they're nasty and gross while women are perfect, but that doesn't really matter :P

5/30/2010 #5
Rae D. Magdon

Honestly, I don't really "get" the whole pansexual title... but then again, I'm just a boring old lesbian. I certainly don't have a problem with it, and see no reason why someone shouldn't identify as pansexual... I am just unsure how it's different from a bisexual person who wouldn't mind sleeping with a transsexual person, a transgender person, or a crossdresser or something. This is probably just because I don't know any pansexual people and have not seen the term used clearly. If you would like to offer an explanation, I'd love to read it, because I'd like to educate myself. xD

PS: Aren't all people supposed to be attracted to personalities and not just bodies? I mean, the body has something to do with it, or everyone would just be sleeping with everyone... but isn't it about spiritual connection?

5/30/2010 #6
Brenda Agaro

Hopefully this will help:

While bisexuality is the attraction of both genders, pansexuality focuses on the attraction of individuals, but without personal preferences on gender/sex (loving the "person".) A bisexual who doesn't mind sleeping with a transsexual is a pansexual (some bisexuals claim this without knowing that it's actually pansexuality - I was one of them.) It's the feeling of loving another no matter the gender/sex (beyond just male or female.)

As for the PS, you are right. From what I've learned, a person is attracted to another based on compatibility. For example: to an individual who is heterosexual, someone else of the opposite gender appeals to them in appearance, along with interests, temperament, etc.

I apologize if this is vague/confusing. Feel free to ask questions.

6/1/2010 #7
SmallSerpent

I identify simply as 'queer' anymore, unless I absolutely must use a more mainstream identity, in which case I go with 'lesbian.' 'Lesbian' as such is inaccurate, though, at least in that it's an over-simplification, because really I'm a bisexual-leaning lesbian who is about as likely to hook up with a trans*person as I am with a cis*person of the same gender, and will think absolutely nothing of hooking up with a genderless or intersexed individual. Arguably I could ID as 'pansexual,' but I don't for reasons that for now will remain my little secret.

So yeah. Just plain 'queer' here.

6/13/2010 #8
SmallSerpent

Uh... that's q-u-e-e-r. One of the annoying things about which is that sometimes my identity gets censured as a slur. Lol.

6/13/2010 #9
Ellie.H

That is what I always wondered - I was told you couldn't consider yourself bisexual unless you have had experience with the same sex...how can any who has never had sex have any sexual orientation then? I am the typical horny sixteen year old but being a shy, anti-social weirdo I'm a dateless virgin - the farthest I've gotten was making out on a bed before someone walked into the room.

I know I'm attracted to guys - any virgin who likes guys is considered heterosexual, right? I'm also attracted to girls just about as much as guys and I have been ever since I started to be attracted to people. Why am I not "allowed" to identify as bisexual? I would kiss, date, have sex with a guy or a girl. I don't think I need a label but if I am certain of my sexuality - that I have always liked both sexes - I can say I'm a bisexual who hasn't had sex yet.

Haha okay, I'll admit I'm slightly embarrassed to say I'm a sixteen year old virgin - not that there's really anything wrong with it, it's not that bad buuuut I still am.

10/31/2010 . Edited 10/31/2010 #10
PaintedPassion

I think the thing about sex is crap. My mother uses it against me the opposite way. "You can't know you're gay. You haven't had sex with a guy." Or "You haven't given guys a chance." Sp apparently, you just have to screw every gender to know what you're attracted to. Kidding. I think you just know what you are and are not attracted to. Some people do have to experiment to find out for sure, while others just know. It depends on the person. Once I identified as a lesbian, I knew what I felt towards girls was different from guys. There was no need to sleep with something I am not attracted to.

While I do identify as a lesbian, I keep an open mind out to transexuals and personalities and anything else I could fall in love with. There's a fine gender line that the world is slowly, slowly beginning to try to demolish, with our effeminate men, masculine women, transgenders, and gender-defying individuals. I think gender boundaries and standards were meant to be crossed since day 1, since one gender acting a certain way is utterly ridiculous.

Pansexuality makes perfect sense to me, and I see it differently from bisexuality because it almost isn't a normal sexuality, in the sense of the typical "What gender are you attracted to?" Because the bisexual's answer might be "both" or maybe even "all." while the pansexual would answer that they don't attract to genders, just people. They don't see that fine line. They see people they like and aspects they like. I personally kinda wish I could be pansexual, because I really admire the mindset, but I'm just an open-minded lesbian.

11/15/2010 #11
Jessica Pryce

The way I've always seen pansexuality is this: basically you just don't care what the body form of the person you're attracted to is. I think it's especially poignant if you don't look at genitalia, either, i.e. you don't care if you're dating someone who's intersexed, and find their body just as attractive as you might find someone who is male-bodied with a penis or female-bodied with a vagina. And you're not alone in being pansexual; I personally identify as a pansexual intersexed person, and I am attracted to any body. I'll admit that there are some bodies that I am more attracted to, but I would probably never turn away someone based on their body. I only generally identify as a lesbian because it's easier than explaining to everyone and their mother about pansexuality.

11/20/2010 #12
Kitmaro

Well I just think ya love who ya love. Ya don't gotta sleep with a certain type of person to determine your sexuality. People have their preferences.

12/7/2010 #13
Vampire.Panda
Yes as another pansexual virgin (I'm 18 though and the farthest I've gone is kiss haha) I understand the stress that comes with having to explain what pansexuality is. Most people automatically asume that Its something bad or been called a whore at least once but I'm not. I'm more of a 'prude' actually (or so I've been called) I'm only planning on sleeping with one person, and waiting that I'm sure that person is right for me. I though I was bisexual until I learned about pansexuality, then I knew that I was pansexual. To me I see looks and compliment them but it's like a passing comment l, like saying your hair looks nice. The 2 girls I've had major crushes on were my best friends who I, after some time was emotionaly attracted to. It was like a gradual thing that happened over a few years, so I guess I'm not your typical teenage girl, but really what's wrong with it? I've come out to some pretty religous people and my friends parents, they know me and understand I'm just looking for someone to spend my life with, and have actually told me they love how open I am to finding someone and my willingness to wait for that person. Although I must say I'd prefer it to be a guy cause I really want kids :3, but if I fall head over heels for a girl we can always adopt, there are pleanty of children who need a loving home :D.
1/16/2011 #14
Goldfish Policy

Hi Tah! (This forum is kind of dead but I will bring it back to life with my teeth.)

While I disagree that having had sex with one gender automatically specifies your sexual orientation, I do understand why people would think that. Ignorance is bliss, right? I think it would also be increasingly more difficult for a straight, gay or lesbian to understand bisexuality or pansexuality, which pretty much cuts out the majority. People who are solely attracted to one gender just don't know what it would be like to be attracted to all genders, with or without having sex with them. And the sex questions (Have you had sex with a trannie? Have you had sex with guys and girls?)) is sought after as proof of your sexuality so that they can further justify your craziness.

Was that a long bit of gibberish? The point is, it is easier for people to understand the definition of Bisexual or Pansexual once knowing who you've slept with to give themselves examples of your orientation. Also, women who want to have sex with men don't know the full extent of that sexuality until they do it (and maybe even experiment elsewhere). This validates their sexuality and unconsciously tells the individual that that is what they want out of sex. So it can be assumed that the same thing goes for all sexual orientations. That is why people ask.

For example, I am and have always identified myself as bisexual. I have always been attracted to every aspect of both sexes. But it wasn't until years later when I did have sex with males and females that I realized I am more attracted to the female form but prefer the act of sex to be had with men. I couldn't have known that 100%ly until I had sex with all of the above. So when someone says they are pansexual, I would also wonder if they had sex with a transexual or a unisex and if they preferred them over a male or female and that is why they chose to identify as pansexual. Not that that is a necessary likelihood, that you would prefer one thing over the other, but I would still wonder none-the-less. If an individual pushes the questions, they are just uneducated, arrogant sons of bees.

I love you sexy flamboyant people for being so open about this topic. :)

2/10/2011 #15
Goldfish Policy

Hi Tah! (This forum is kind of dead but I will bring it back to life with my teeth.)

While I disagree that having had sex with one gender automatically specifies your sexual orientation, I do understand why people would think that. Ignorance is bliss, right? I think it would also be increasingly more difficult for a straight, gay or lesbian to understand bisexuality or pansexuality, which pretty much cuts out the majority. People who are solely attracted to one gender just don't know what it would be like to be attracted to all genders, with or without having sex with them. And the sex questions (Have you had sex with a trannie? Have you had sex with guys and girls?)) is sought after as proof of your sexuality so that they can further justify your craziness.

Was that a long bit of gibberish? The point is, it is easier for people to understand the definition of Bisexual or Pansexual once knowing who you've slept with to give themselves examples of your orientation. Also, women who want to have sex with men don't know the full extent of that sexuality until they do it (and maybe even experiment elsewhere). This validates their sexuality and unconsciously tells the individual that that is what they want out of sex. So it can be assumed that the same thing goes for all sexual orientations. That is why people ask.

For example, I am and have always identified myself as bisexual. I have always been attracted to every aspect of both sexes. But it wasn't until years later when I did have sex with males and females that I realized I am more attracted to the female form but prefer the act of sex to be had with men. I couldn't have known that 100%ly until I had sex with all of the above. So when someone says they are pansexual, I would also wonder if they had sex with a transexual or a unisex and if they preferred them over a male or female and that is why they chose to identify as pansexual. Not that that is a necessary likelihood, that you would prefer one thing over the other, but I would still wonder none-the-less. If an individual pushes the questions, they are just uneducated, arrogant sons of bees.

I love you sexy flamboyant people for being so open about this topic. :)

2/10/2011 #16
JeanneLaska

Well, look, this is a very interesting topic.

So I am a cisgendered, heterosexual female. And while I think I am curious and open-minded enough to eventually understand this whole issue better, I must say, yes, the question of experience tends to pop up in my mind when people define their sexual orientation. I wouldn't go around and claim things and placate them on other people, though. It is more of an open interrogation...

First of all, all words are artificially limiting, whether those like "heterosexual", "homosexual", "bisexual" or those like "man" and "woman". Secondly, of course our attractions are partially influenced, oriented, even controlled by our socialization mode.

In this light, actual experience doesn't necessarily match your most individual desire. I myself have slept with guys I wasn't attracted to, while having been way more attracted to some girls. That has never made me feel even remotely bisexual, as I feel any sexual relation with girls would be forced, at least as much as forced relations I've had with other guys I neither loved nor was attracted to. I love the female body, but I just can't see it as a sexual object.

I also have to wonder what "love" has to do with any of this. The most obvious proof for me that love knows no gender is that you usually love your parents of both sexes/genders, your sisters and brothers, your girlfriends and boyfriends... I don't think love of any kind has anything at all to do with sex or sexual orientation. So, of course I can love girls. That still doesn't mean I'll have sex with them, other perhaps than as some kind of experiment (but even thinking of this as an experiment seems to tag me as "hetero" all the way). Same as I can love boys I won't have sex with.

Maybe I've just been irremediably struck by this line at the beginning of the Velvet Goldmine movie... Which basically said: it's trendy nowadays to call oneself bisexual, but it doesn't really mean anything if you haven't had sex with both sexes in fact. As in: faced with a penis or a vagina, would you really be able to go through with it? Which I feel doesn't necessarily apply to everyone, but is maybe not completely worthless as an argument.

With hindsight, I don't think I was truly "sexual" at all (whether hetero-, homo- or bi-) when I lost my virginity. Being a virgin, in my case, was an evidence of my relative asexuality. I don't find it either stupid or offensive to assume so... Though obviously, "virgin" itself is another limiting, artificially unifying word that serves to cover very different situations. In itself, being a virgin doesn't tell anything about your sexual experience. Sexual experience isn't limited to sex with a partner, right? Let alone PIV sex... I am thus used to saying: the concept of "virginity" has no value whatsoever, and was solely invented as a means to oppress women (and occasionally men, though it's always had very different implications for men in Western societies).

What does being a "virgin" even mean? I'm sure you can break your own hymen with a dildo... The idea that you lose your virginity only as a penis enters your vagina (or conversely: as your penis enters a vagina) is incredibly heterosexist. And what about sodomy? Are you still a virgin if you've only been anally penetrated? All these considerations are clearly ridiculous.

So, as a conclusion... I simply feel that the physical question cannot be evacuated entirely, whatever -sexual you define yourself as. Which is why I am still intrigued by the idea of pansexuality. How can you not care about your lover's body form? Who doesn't? I don't even think it's possible in the case of attraction, and I don't even believe attraction always stretches to potential sex. I could also add that I do not consider "sexuality" as natural, but as cultural... It's an education. I'm not sure anyone is whatever-sexual to start with. Which doesn't imply it's a choice, either... You don't choose to enjoy or hate writing, or to be good or bad at it. You just do; you just are. Still, writing is something entirely social, cultural and which you must learn.

2/11/2011 #17
Jessica Pryce
Out of sheer curiousity, how many people here have taken womens/gender studies or are interested in the field?
2/11/2011 #18
JeanneLaska

Definitely interested in the field, though I've never taken any proper course in it. And probably never will, since that would imply going back to school after finishing my master's... Aaargh. LOL

2/11/2011 #19
Raine August
While Tah already knows my gender and sexual orientation, the rest of you don't what with me being pretty new to this site. I'm a female panssexual, although with each passing day, I've been wondering if I even need/want a label. I don't fall in love with a gender or a person's looks, although there is a small attraction there... To me, the outside is irrelevant until I've gotten to know the person. I've noticed that with my friends, the ones who have certain qualities that press all of the wrong buttons, I tend to find less attractive. The ones who have been supportive, respect my boundaries, and make me smile, I tend to find very attractive. That's just me though. *shrug*
4/4/2011 #20
Purple.Star84

I was confused by the idea of pansexual as well. I'm bisexual and since bisexual means you aren't attracted to one gender over the other or any of the other ways to say it. I can't wrap my head around the idea of a bisexual who wouldn't be willing to have sex with (or date etc.) someone that was transgendered or changed their gender. Or any of the different various possibilities. But if that is what pansexual is, then I guess I'm really pansexual. Because I can't see the difference.

This reminds me of a blog I wrote though http : // stephaniejoloots . wordpress . com / 2011 / 06 / 23 / im-not-going-to-lie-im-bisexual /

As always take out the spaces. I'm warning you it is long, but it is about how I believe most people are actually bisexual and simply lie about it. Either because they don't understand what it means, or because it is easier to lie and be accepted then tell the truth and be ridiculed. With this new found wisdom I'm half tempted to change the title, but I think it might just confuse people farther. I might have to research a little and write another one explaining all the different sexuality. But I kept it as simple as possible in the blog, because it was long enough to begin with and I still think it might confuse people. Or they will just simply refuse to accept the statics I have there.

7/7/2011 #21
Makani Blancarte

To answer Jessica Pryce's question, I actually have taken Intro to Women's Studies in undergraduate school, and it was certainly an eye-opener regarding views on women throughout history and in modern times. The class had a slight feminist slant, which made me realize that I can be classified as a feminist.

As far as the topic of this thread, I'm a heterosexual cis-female with bi-curious tendencies. I'm fairly certain I'm not bisexual, but I'm occasionally attracted to other women both physically and emotionally. I was raised in a highly conservative family, but once I went off to college, I became very open-minded on gender, sex, orientation, etc.

I tend to write about characters with ambiguous sexual orientation because I believe this topic is far more complex than labels can ever hope to cover.

7/30/2011 #22
Firefly Burning

I'm a pansexual too.

8/3/2011 #23
centernova

Oh, have I been there and back. I'm panromantic homosexual. To most people, that starts off by being HELL to define. And then, people are like, "how can you be both panromantic AND homosexual? Don't they contradict each other?" When I explain that I can fall in love with anyone, boy, girl, transgender, alien species, yet I only want to do sexy things with other girls, I always get some variation on "why would you love someone that you don't want to have sex with?"

Because this is what the world has come to, everyone. :p Asexuals, you may go home now.

But seriously, it takes forever to explain and a good portion of people still don't understand.

If it was purely sexual, wouldn't every virgin in the world be asexual, then?

This is the best quote ever, by the way, and I might actually borrow it, because it could make stuff easier to explain. I can't comment on the Bible Belt thing, as I live there now, and when I lived in the Corn Belt, I identified as bi.

11/11/2011 #24
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