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Knightmare Elite

Okay, I know that vampires in general are once again over saturating the media.

I've always loved vampires, but I'm very picky about the types of vampires that I can accept. Personally, I think the vampires of Underworld are the best representation of vampires. I don't get why they churn out all these shitty vampire movies with 'vampires' that look like some homeless demon that just got a face full of battery acid.

As for lesbian vampires, sigh. Just hearing that name, people immediately envision a movie with two hot women making out and killing some random people. There's usually a razor thin plot and 90% of the time the lesbians get killed by the straight hero which is usually a guy/priest/ex-boyfriend. Why do directors and producers refuse to take the idea of a lesbian vampire seriously? Elizabeth Bathory is the closest I've seen a somewhat respectable "lesbian vampire" in popular media. It's not for a lack of faith in a strong female lead in a vampire series. Look at Underworld, or Blood the last vampire, or Hellsing (anime version). Though, in relation to Underworld, I'm sure if Selene were a lesbian,she'd have sacrificed herself in the end or received a cheap off screen death for her troubles.

So what I'm asking everyone is what do you feel are the main issues with the lesbian vampire genre, and what can be done to fix it. Once Twilight is over, vampires will again become uncool and return to obscurity for another five years before someone else gets lucky. Is the world ready for a lesbian vampire movie? Judging by the double standards like the Bruno movie and America's seemingly ambiguous love affair with gay male leads, it makes me wonder if two girls kissing is 'so hot', why does everyone rather see 'two guys kissing'? The normal consensus was that gay guys are supposed to be gross, and yet, they're in movies, books, video games and lesbians which are seemingly the fantasy of every male 14-99 are treated like a rotting zombie.

So does anyone have any idea as to why the lesbian vampire genre is such a joke?

9/12/2010 #1
Lumynescence

You know, it's a very strange thing when it comes to comparing homosexual men to homosexual women in the media, to how they are presented in the media.

I think in all honesty, it boils down to sexism. Gay men can be strong leads because they are...men. And when gay couples are presented to the media, it is usually because it is two men in love. Let's face it- lesbians are a joke in the media, for the most part. If you want to find media on gay men, you will find Brokeback Mountain and stories about men in love, or flamboyant men who are proud to strut their stuff. You want to find lesbians in the media, and mostly you will find out poorly filmed porn with two hot straight girls playing the part. Most of the people who are in charge of the media- of filming, directing, and producing, are men. Some of them don't mind gay men in the media to promote the LGBT community. But if there are lesbians, they better be hot and they better turn the audience on.

Do you get what I'm saying? It's really a shame that lesbian couples aren't taken seriously by the media- which is why I believe there needs to be an influx in GOOD media for lesbians, be it books and movies and scripts. I think when people envision lesbian vampires, they won't even consider it because what comes to their minds will be something similar to the poorly filmed porn that is everywhere- hot girls with fangs making out. Nothing of substance.

I personally think if someone worked hard at it, a very good movie or book could be written or filmed about lesbian vampires. But I don't think the rest of the world feels the same way.

9/12/2010 #2
Knightmare Elite

I agree with you 100%. While the double standards will never go away, the quality of the work on the lesbian end needs to be improved. What I don't understand is that lesbians have such a small voice in the film industry, so when these indie film makers get the chance to make movies, they church out these TERRIBLE generic movies that have every cliche in the book and remind people exactly why they don't want to watch lesbian movies in the first place.

I'm not saying all lesbian film makers do that, it's just the majority of what I've seen are either perfect world movies that either take place in 'Gayville, USA' where everyone seemingly down to the president is either gay or inexplicably pro gay, or the types where people have an issue with the character being gay for like half the movie and then they conveniently turn around just in time for that heartwarming cookie cutter happy ending.

I've been burned by too many awful low budget lesbian vampire movies (or lesbian films in general) that is seems even the creators didn't give a shit. If you have an opportunity to create something that will speak for an ignored crowd, why half ass it?

9/13/2010 #3
Limited Edition

Well, movies with gay men are made to appeal to women, which is why the plot has to be thicker and have more substance, especially with the romance. They are not made to appeal to men, because the gay population is too small.

It's the same with lesbians, it's made to appeal to men and not women, because there are too few lesbians to bring in the bucks, and men don't really care if there is a plot or romance between them, they just want a nice cleavage and minimal clothing.

9/13/2010 #4
Knightmare Elite

I can't speak for all men but if a movie has a hair thin plot and is just an excuse for half women to make out for 90 min I just turn it off. I'm probably one of the only guys who loved 'The Craft', even though it's kinda cheesy by today's standards. I remember Sony was going to fast track a sequel with 'sexy witches' and I cringed. I knew it was going to be a rehash of the original with the same ending with the sex dialed to 11, thankfully the idea was shelved. I'd love to see more quality lesbian media that is made by women for women.

Even though I'm a guy, I get that many of the movies unfortunately try to appeal to us, but they generalize what men want. Not every guy is a testosterone filled douche bag that worships boobies and has the attention span of a newborn. People are afraid to take a chance because they think it'll fail. It happens to many lesbian film makers as well as writers. I go out of my way to find those obscure stories and films that break the mold and really give the audience a fair and honest look into a woman's world with 'beer goggles'.

The issue I see with lesbian vampire fiction is, even if someone were to make a successful lesbian. They would likely take the route of branching her off a more established male vampire. Something like Dracula's daughter, or Van Helsing's widow because people would associate with those. We need something fresh, a character and world built from the ground up that isn't automatically shadowed by a strong male character. She could work along one, as long as her lesbianism doesn't morph into a forgettable subplot.

Again I reference the Underworld series because of its strong female leads. Even if the women were often chasing the male lead, they were strong and well defined characters that could easily stand on their own. They weren't just sex objects, they have personality and made the audience give a shit whether they lived or died. I want to see a lesbian vampire movie/novel with characters like that.

9/13/2010 #5
Limited Edition

I apologize, it was phrased poorly. Of course I don't mean that men are stupid (I'm definitely not one those men hating types). But it's not what the population is like that counts, it's what Hollywood thinks they are like. Hollywood tends to for example think that a man punches a guy if they see them helping their girlfriend putting skis on. Of course there are probably men like this, but urgghhh

That is also what many filmmakers think is their target. Testosterone filled 15 year olds. This is Sparta, anyone? Hahahaha

Personally I'm not much for Underworld, but I get what you mean.

9/13/2010 #6
PaintedPassion

I've always wondered myself why there are so few lesbian vampires. In the Sookie Stackhouse series, there's a couple minor character lesbian vamps mentioned, but there never seems to be a story ABOUT a lesbian vampire. It saddens me, because I picture vampires kind of sexually open.

I'm writing my own vampire novel, where the main character happens to prefer women. I only have one chapter up here so far (Fertility) because I'm trying to finish another story of mine.

Also, my best friend gave me a book with a bunch of short stories about lesbian vampires. There was a retelling of Dracula with Dracula being female, and some other things, but the stories were mostly.. boring, not gonna lie. Like older romance novels, which don't interest me much. I'd rather read something about adventure with a good plot with some lesbian love as well, but not cheesy romance.

I personally love Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Although she's not gay nor is any vampire, they do have a main character come out as a lesbian and focus on her relationship. I love it. The entire show, not just the gayness.

But I have always asked myself why there weren't lesbian vampires. Even in anime, I can't find any.

9/13/2010 #7
Eskye

I find it almost ironic that lesbian vampires aren't more present as real literary characters - as opposed to pulp fiction characters and such - in today's fiction. Why?

Because the first vampire novel ever written was completely lesbian subtext. Yes, Carmilla, from the French author Joseph Sheridan Le Fanu. Possibly my favorite piece of literature ever. Bram Stoker used it as inspiration - and, if you've read both, more than just inspiration - for his Dracula. In fact, most fiction featuring vampires after this novel took pieces out of it. Including lesbian subtext. If you watch old vampire scare movies or read old novels, you may notice the large amount of lesbian subtext.

However, this artful addition of homosexual subtext has been lost in recent years. (Though I do believe that Alice from Twilight is lesbian, from reading the books.)

Mostly, I think the genre is just completely overrun by a lack of literary talent at all. Nothing may ever compare to Carmilla in my opinion, but nearly everything is just "Vampire. Rawr. Hot. Yum. Yay. End." Quoted. (An exaggeration that isn't very far from the truth, I daresay.) But part of the problem is that homosexual themes merely hid behind any piece of great literature. Ever read Henry David Thoreau? Super gay. For Emerson, actually. But nobody says so. Which is ridiculous. And probably why the themes can't carry through. I think that the style of writing - as there is a distinctly popular style of writing in any time period - has changed from the subtext to metaphorical to nobody understands what the hell they mean back to metaphorical, then completely literal. Most of the literature we read today is completely literal, and lacks the kind of ideas and thinking present in older fiction. Of course, there are many exceptions, but not enough to overrule the style of this age. But because the style is literal, the plots are almost always lacking, therefore the only lesbianism that we really see is the straight in your face kind.

To be honest, most of the gay fiction is also like this. As well as heterosexual fiction. It just so happens that there are more heterosexual authors, which means that their percentage of good stories with good plots is much larger. Meaning, they're just lucky that they're straight, because they have more to choose from. I consider it to be like cows. Only a few cows have good milk (mind that I'm lactose intolerant). Lets call it one percent. If one farmer just doesn't have enough cows, perhaps because they are in the unfortunate circumstance that there just aren't many dairy farmers like him, he won't have much good milk coming out. But say the neighbor farmer has billions of cows because he's lucky like that. Well, because they both have a 1% chance at getting good milk, the lucky neighbor farmer just has to get more quality milk, simply because he has more cows.

Basically, heterosexuals have a better chance at getting the good fiction simply because they have more people writing it. Even gay men have a better chance, because more people are writing it. Simply put, lesbians like me just aren't lucky. With only about 2% of a population being lesbian, and way more straight men (like, 90%) who just want to read about them having sex, it's easy to see how they don't exist.

I think the entire first part of my post will be be thesis for my Comparative Lit. major. Yeah. Seems like a good idea. I just love talking about Carmilla.

PaintedPassion, there is a manga called Mondlicht Tsubasa or something like that. It has to do with vampires, and clearly has a lesbian subplot, if not overriding theme.

9/13/2010 . Edited 9/13/2010 #8
Lumynescence

I completely agree with Eskye. We are the minority. Plain and simple.

But is it too much to ask for a romantic movie that features two lesbians that isn't gaudy or sexual? I suppose we will find out.

This is a little unrelated, but Darren Aronofsky's newest film, The Black Swan, is coming out this year. He is the director of Requiem for a Dream and The Fountain, and he creates fantastic films. The Black Swan will feature a lesbian scene, but unfortunately the movie isn't a romance. It is a psychological thriller, and it will only feature a scene where there is "angry, revengeful sex". One of the women in the movie is 'after' the protagonist, who is played by Natalie Portman. Knowing Darren, the scene will probably not be poorly paced and he will probably nail it, but still, it is only a scene with lesbian subtext throughout the movie. Regardless, it is still something to look forward too. Here is a trailer if anyone is interested. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jaI1XOB-bs

This doesn't have to do with vampires but it has to do with the media...my ideal movie would just be a romance between two women- in the light of The Fountain or Titanic, or any of the great romance movies. Not something cheesy or gaudy- just love in its purest form.

9/13/2010 #9
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